we are hoping when erdo gone we can recover as intellectuals are still out there. clock is ticking for him.
but most terrifying thing is rising popularity of the populist leaders in the west.
How Turkey Purged Its Intellectuals
201–210 of 224 posts
Re: How Turkey Purged Its Intellectuals
#202The, purge, the loss of jobs, the continuous state of emergency, all terrible ideas. However, painting everyone affected as "intellectual"s is going a bit too far. Although many innocent people got hurt, a lot of them were nur cult members. They believe said nursi was a prophet. They took over the education industry to spread their dogmas. Everyone in Turkey knew that and turned a blind eye because they were harmless.
Re: How Turkey Purged Its Intellectuals
#203Earlier quoted context omitted.
Turkey is an extension of a multi-national empire which had extreme levels of animosity between its nations, people who identified as non-turks were severely penalized in the past, and to this day allegations of having a non Turk grandparent is something that can be used against politicians. Armenian is still considered an offensive word in Turkey, (as is Turk in Armenia), so portraying Turkey as an idyllic multi-nat…
I dont really understand why people are making concrete assumptions about a terrorist organization without living in the country. Terrorism of PKK cannot be comparable to American revolution. You never lived in Turkey and you dont know the culture there. Turkey and US have completely different cultural basis and you cant just show up and making assumptions like these. I mean of course you can, from my point of view i…
If you want examples closer to Turkey take Greek War of Independence, or forces fighting for liberation of Bulgaria, or northern Ireland. I have not lived in Turkey but my grandparents did, and i know some people who do live in Turkey. Of course i do not support terrorism, but PKK exists largely because unfair laws, untold stories, and
ethnic hatred existing in Turkey. The only way to really win the fight with PKK is not force, but free speech and human rights.
If you could tell your perspective on the issue, of why what i say is baseless and funny, I would be grateful.
Re: How Turkey Purged Its Intellectuals
#204My favorite concept right now is the “meritocracy of ideas” - a fancy way of saying that the best ideas win. Somehow I feel that this is a core driver for success, in an organization, small or big. So by excluding smart people and their ideas you may significantly limit yourself and the futures your organization.
Meritocracy.... a concept that sounds good in principle but ends up being disastrous. The problem is the roots of the word itself.
Would you mind to elaborate? Maybe another concept name would be better
Re: How Turkey Purged Its Intellectuals
#205Earlier quoted context omitted.
I dont really understand why people are making concrete assumptions about a terrorist organization without living in the country. Terrorism of PKK cannot be comparable to American revolution. You never lived in Turkey and you dont know the culture there. Turkey and US have completely different cultural basis and you cant just show up and making assumptions like these. I mean of course you can, from my point of view i…
If you want examples closer to Turkey take Greek War of Independence, or forces fighting for liberation of Bulgaria, or northern Ireland. I have not lived in Turkey but my grandparents did, and i know some people who do live in Turkey. Of course i do not support terrorism, but PKK exists largely because unfair laws, untold stories, and ethnic hatred existing in Turkey. The only way to really win the fight with PKK is…
PKK killed a Turkish Diplomat in Northern Iraq last week [0]. You can't really explain this by lack of free speech or human rights. There are many cases like this in Turkey's history where innocent people get assassinated by some cowards.
[0]: https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/iraq-sh...
Re: How Turkey Purged Its Intellectuals
#206Earlier quoted context omitted.
...so postwar Britain was at serious risk of being taken over by fascists? Probably something more like https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xSVqLHghLpw
Immediately after WW2 all fascists worldwide disappeared in a poof of smoke. Also their rise to power has always been abrupt and without warning via an on/off switch.
Wow, you really think British fascism was a serious political threat after six years of war against various fascist powers. That’s a truly McCarthyesque level of paranoia.
Re: How Turkey Purged Its Intellectuals
#207Earlier quoted context omitted.
It sounds like someone needs to organize some good, seaworthy boats to come pick these people up and take them someplace better, and help them get set up. After all, if they're intellectuals, they should be a huge asset to any country that takes them in. There's a reason we have the term "brain drain": countries that get the brains usually benefit greatly, while the countries losing them suffer economically.
I know you didnt mean this, but perhaps these people don't want to leave? Turkey is not a hellhole. Sure, it is a divided country, but it has a rich history and lots of beauty (I say that not being a Turk, nor being from Istanbul). Let's remember that the current position as a developing nation is historically rather new. There is a strong sense of nostalgia and, until recently, there was some realistic hope that Tur…
Yes, I absolutely did mean this. Just read the comment I responded to:
"Some people tried to go to Greece on boats which many of them died on the way."
Obviously, those people thought it was enough of a hellhole that they risked their lives to take boats to Greece, and died!
>Those academics who stayed in Turkey despite their credentials, probably have such a preference.
I'm not talking about anyone who's staying there. I'm talking about people who are actively trying to escape and are risking their lives to get out. Obviously, they're perfectly willing to abandon those cities "full of thousands of years of history". Besides, western Europe is chock full of other cities with thousands of years of history that don't have the problems Turkey has, and that's where these people were headed to, not the US or Canada.
Re: How Turkey Purged Its Intellectuals
#208Earlier quoted context omitted.
Well in places where the intellectuals are fleeing, that's basically what they're doing, no? They're not trying to control the money exactly, but they are ceasing to share their skills with the rest of the people in that country, and removing themselves from its economy.
I don’t think it is right. They harm their selves much more than its country. Dictator will easily buy their replacement from free world when needed. The problem is that intellectuals could be bought and sold because there are no contract commitments on how to use the knowledge. You are even free to use your knowledge against your teacher to make him to leave the country.
What? I have almost no idea what you're trying to say here. Are you saying that intellectuals should be forced to stay in their countries with dictators? I guess you're a big fan of East Germany and North Korea, huh?
Re: How Turkey Purged Its Intellectuals
#209Same thing has happened in Hungary https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2019/06/george-...
Amazing how a billionaire funding an institution with a self-admitted propaganda purpose is 'democracy', while elected officials trying to limit the influence of foreign capital is 'authoritarian'. By that logic, limiting the influence of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confucius_Institute is also anti-democratic.
It is quite amazing that different situations are different.
Re: How Turkey Purged Its Intellectuals
#210Earlier quoted context omitted.
It’s probably the closest thing we have to a North Star metric when evaluating a country. Everything that people desire is underpinned by GDP, and it isn’t particularly high anywhere on Earth.
> Everything that people desire is underpinned by GDP That's a very extreme position. People desire more than what can be bought at the market. https://www.theguardian.com/news/datablog/2012/may/24/robert...
True, but they can realise those desires more easily if they’re available at the market. In fact it’s hard to imagine an area of human interest or endeavour that is not supported by the activities measured by GDP in some way. I’m not saying it’s the only metric we should attend to, or even that it’s a perfect economic metric, but rather that it’s a reasonable headline metric to use. It is only one number, so it cannot express the whole reality of life within a country; but it can convey some sense of the relative opportunities for that country. There is a meaningful and quantifiable difference between living in an economy with a GDP of $45 million (GDP per capita $3,566) and $20 trillion (GDP per capita $64,767).