I thought I was being ‘blacklisted’, so I demanded to see colleagues’ emails • Hacker News Board

Re: I thought I was being ‘blacklisted’, so I demanded to see colleagues’ emails

#131

Post by mistermann » Thu, Jul 25, 2019, 3:51 PM UTC

stone-monkey wrote: post #85

mistermann wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The real world is crazy. It's quite amazing how large the gap is between the way the world is described to us through various mediums, versus the clearly observable reality of it. FTA: > I approached the individuals and the institutions concerned about the content of my Subject Access Request. They all refused to discuss the matter with me, so I can only speculate as to what was going on. Of course, these people we…

>The adult world, even at the highest levels of authority, largely consists of the same petty cliques, backstabbing, lying, and whatnot that you'd experience in high school I'm not a fan of claiming this type of behavior is childish and something we leave behind after high school. Before advances in mass transportation that made it feasible for people to uproot and move to a new community, most people were stuck in t…

My point was basically that people tend to have this idea in their mind that for the most part, adults "behave like adults", in that they grow out of the negative social behaviors that are easily observed in a school setting, whereas the reality seems to be that what's actually happening is that this behavior simply becomes more sophisticated and better hidden, or ignored as if it didn't exist.

Re: I thought I was being ‘blacklisted’, so I demanded to see colleagues’ emails

#132

Post by Dayshine » Thu, Jul 25, 2019, 3:54 PM UTC

Silhouette wrote: post #128

pjc50 wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

GDPR allows you to stall people for at least a month, which is hardly "real time", and also to not disclose information which would affect the privacy of others.

But neither of those is necessarily sufficient for the sorts of situations I'm talking about here.

In what kind of situation would a month of delay and complete redaction of any information given in confidence by other people?

The GDPR requires you to balance the rights of all involved parties.

Re: I thought I was being ‘blacklisted’, so I demanded to see colleagues’ emails

#133

Post by Grue3 » Thu, Jul 25, 2019, 3:59 PM UTC

awinder wrote: post #119

Grue3 wrote: post #82

>I was able to ask my PhD college, and several other institutions, to see all emails in which my name appeared in either the subject line or the body of the email. The scariest part is that this is apparently possible in countries under the jurisdiction of GDPR now (and possibly even outside of it). Your private emails talking about a third party might be exposed at the request of the said third party. Does no one el…

I'm pretty sure that this would only apply in the contexts of business dealings -- anything you produce from a business you work for should not be considered your private anything, it's work material you produced for that employer, and the actions became the employer's actions after executed.

Even in business context this can be weaponised. For example two executives in a company discuss some sort of business strategy and mention the competitor's CEO by name (also the competitor's company happens to be named after its CEO so it's impossible to discuss it without saying his or her name). The competitor's CEO GDPRs the emails and learns of the secret business plan as a result.

Re: I thought I was being ‘blacklisted’, so I demanded to see colleagues’ emails

#134

Post by nkurz » Thu, Jul 25, 2019, 3:59 PM UTC

sct202 wrote: post #66

nkurz wrote: post #34

There are new EU-wide data regulations, known as the GDPR, that were introduced in 2018. These regulations allow people to make a data request, called a Subject Access Request, to any institution that holds any data on them. The definition of data is pretty broad, and I was able to ask my PhD college, and several other institutions, to see all emails in which my name appeared in either the subject line or the body of…

That doesn't seem fair since the emails were sent long before the writer made the requests. If she had never asked for the emails, the same things would be said about her.

Sure, I don't mean that it was evidence at the time, rather that suspicions held by the advisor seem to have been proved true. I presume that advisor felt justified in warning others that the author might be a problematic hire, and a scandal like this is evidence that the suspicion was correct.

I think the right question to ask is whether an advisor is obligated to give positive recommendations for an advisee if they come to regret having taken them on. My sense is that the advisor was correct to notice that socially something was "off" about the author, and correct that others might regret hiring her, just as he(?) had come to regret choosing her as a student. I don't know though whether it's legal under current EU law to act on these observations and experiences.

Re: I thought I was being ‘blacklisted’, so I demanded to see colleagues’ emails

#135

Post by wallace_f » Thu, Jul 25, 2019, 4:01 PM UTC

harryh wrote: post #28

wallace_f wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would this work in the way the article described? Any email between other people containing your name in it?

Yes.

But private, no such luck?

Re: I thought I was being ‘blacklisted’, so I demanded to see colleagues’ emails

#136

Post by icebraining » Thu, Jul 25, 2019, 4:08 PM UTC

sysbin wrote: post #125

bena wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also, the paradox is that it doesn't matter one bit whether free will exists or not. Because either it does and we are making conscious choices and everything that normally follows with that. Or it doesn't and everything we say, do, and think is predetermined. However, if that's the case, then you are predetermined to be someone to be swayed by certain arguments. You are predetermined to either believe or not in free…

Well, I'm proclaiming free will doesn't exist. Neuroscience exhibits supporting evidence that we don't have free will. There hasn't been anything exhibiting that we have free will. Your rhetoric that nothing matters could have been used when people assumed the world was flat and others were challenging that popular assumption. Nonetheless, the world gets better overtime and when people have a realistic understanding…

If there's no free will, the people punishing murderers have no choice to rehabilitate instead. Choosing between punishing or rehabilitating requires free will.

Re: I thought I was being ‘blacklisted’, so I demanded to see colleagues’ emails

#137

Post by sp332 » Thu, Jul 25, 2019, 4:14 PM UTC

inetknght wrote: post #106

sp332 wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Whisper networks are less-powerful people warning each other about more-powerful people. People with power don't need to hide their communications so much because they are less vulnerable.

> People with power don't need to hide their communications so much because they are less vulnerable. That's a dangerously naive way of thinking about communications.

People were shocked when the news about Weinstein "came out" but tons of people already knew about it. It was blatant but he was untouchable.

He is a good man to know in the business, but just be careful around him.

With Weinstein’s prompting, one of the other women attempted to convince Skidmore to participate in sex acts

I told people on the boat. I told people at the dinner I was at. Everybody was like, ‘Oh, that’s just Harvey.’

I had a bad experience with Harvey Weinstein in my youth, and as a result, chose never to work with him again and warn others when they did

Weinstein Company employee Lauren O’Connor later detailed Weinstein’s alleged harassment of Nestor in an internal memo obtained by the Times.

https://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood/2017/10/harvey-weinstei...

I want you to know that of all the girls he does this to you are the one I really felt bad about. https://medium.com/bullies-assholes-i-have-known/harvey-wein...

Re: I thought I was being ‘blacklisted’, so I demanded to see colleagues’ emails

#138

Post by syssbin » Thu, Jul 25, 2019, 4:21 PM UTC

icebraining wrote: post #136

sysbin wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, I'm proclaiming free will doesn't exist. Neuroscience exhibits supporting evidence that we don't have free will. There hasn't been anything exhibiting that we have free will. Your rhetoric that nothing matters could have been used when people assumed the world was flat and others were challenging that popular assumption. Nonetheless, the world gets better overtime and when people have a realistic understanding…

If there's no free will, the people punishing murderers have no choice to rehabilitate instead. Choosing between punishing or rehabilitating requires free will.

I'm writing from a cause & effect mindset. So it definitely makes sense that rehabilitation is better than punishment.

To answer what you're trying to point out that has already been answered by me in another post.. Yes, everything is fated to happen. The majority consensus is how society is structured to be and yes the outcome is by fate. Everything may change in the future if fate allows enough people being educated of cause & effect and where the current majority consensus is overcome by understanding of cause & effect. I assume this will happen as technology creates the bridge of data from & to the brain.

Re: I thought I was being ‘blacklisted’, so I demanded to see colleagues’ emails

#139

Post by LyndsySimon » Thu, Jul 25, 2019, 4:23 PM UTC

inetknght wrote: post #111

harryh wrote: post #21

You can generally do the same thing in the US for emails to/from public university addresses with a FOIA request. This seems kind of wild to me, but apparently it works.

Does FOIA apply to private companies? I thought it only applies to governmental institutions.

I'm not an expert here, and I'd have to go read the law in detail to know for sure, but my limited experience leads me to believe that it likely does apply to private companies in the course of business in some cases.

If the company is a federal contractor, for instance, there are a slew of federal regulations with which they must comply to remain eligible for contracts. Likewise, government grants come with strings attached as well.

Finally, if the behavior that you're investigating is illegal - such as discrimination against a "protected class" - there's always the possibility of suing them and acquiring the documents through discovery. All it takes is money.

Re: I thought I was being ‘blacklisted’, so I demanded to see colleagues’ emails

#140

Post by icebraining » Thu, Jul 25, 2019, 4:31 PM UTC

syssbin wrote: post #138

icebraining wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If there's no free will, the people punishing murderers have no choice to rehabilitate instead. Choosing between punishing or rehabilitating requires free will.

I'm writing from a cause & effect mindset. So it definitely makes sense that rehabilitation is better than punishment. To answer what you're trying to point out that has already been answered by me in another post.. Yes, everything is fated to happen. The majority consensus is how society is structured to be and yes the outcome is by fate. Everything may change in the future if fate allows enough people being educate…

My objection is with the word "should", because (and maybe I'm wrong) it implies choice. Nobody says a falling rock should avoid hitting a child - the lack of agency of the rock makes that statement meaningless.

Similarly, if you posit that we have no free will, saying that humanity should rehabilitate and not punish is meaningless.