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I thought I was being ‘blacklisted’, so I demanded to see colleagues’ emails

independent.co.uk

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Re: I thought I was being ‘blacklisted’, so I demanded to see colleagues’ emails

#101

Post by hycaria »

o09rdk wrote: post #79
hycaria wrote: post #5

>Where my personality was called into question perhaps my working-class background, my northern accent, and my Aspergers could be a reasonable explanation. Easier to resort to such hypotheses than be self critical, I guess. Do we really fall in the category where one student with apparently decent thesis results gets ostarcized by her advisor AND the examiners, where no one in the faculty or comittee would stand for…

Others have expressed thoughts I had as well, but to add: I used to basically have your opinion, and then had two experiences that shifted my perspective. The first was a colleague who was known for being overly frank, to put it mildly; for not having any internal controls on sharing what was on his mind. He was (and is) a brilliant individual who is every bit as competent as people much more accomplished than him. I…

I agree that the way of unpleasantness matters.

But for your first example obviously that specific way did rub a lot of people the wrong way. Because you don't mind it, and you had time to get to know him past that, doesn't have to be the majority.

And yes, socially weird people don't surprise me as not fitting in faculty position. You'll eventually have to defend your team, look for opportunities, teach, mentor... You can't give a bad vibe right off with such proeminent roles, because ultimately they're very much based on relationships.

Surely there must be some room for those brilliant but weird people, in small institutions that don't need that much PR or something. And sure some people get to be Paul Erdös and be so dramatically brilliant and querky that the rest is overlooked. That's not true for the average joe.

My friends think I have no empathy (as some people probably think reading my comments!), but in a professional setting (mine being veterinarian, clearly it's not really fitting) "being myself" would do more harm than good, so I'm just playing the expected role, and things are fine, and even enjoyable. Choosing one's battles. I'd rather feel good in my job even if unauthentic.

Re: I thought I was being ‘blacklisted’, so I demanded to see colleagues’ emails

#102

Post by jackhack »

sp332 wrote: post #57
traderjane wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Whisper networks just mean powerful people who talk among each other and do their research. That will always be the case. In politics isn’t that just the standard form of discourse?

Whisper networks are less-powerful people warning each other about more-powerful people. People with power don't need to hide their communications so much because they are less vulnerable.

Have we learned nothing from Wikileaks? Quite the contrary! People with power rely on private/secret communications. And, without power, what is there to communicate, for what you say likely has no value.

I am reminded of Napoleon's dictum: "the secret of war lies in the communications". Sun Tzu would disagree as well, having well documented the value of secrets and spies.

"(private) knowledge is power."

Re: I thought I was being ‘blacklisted’, so I demanded to see colleagues’ emails

#103

Post by ggm »

Singletoned wrote: post #35

As a fellow Aspy, I started reading this thinking, I bet he's a bit of a difficult person. Maybe an Aspy. > Where my personality was called into question perhaps my working-class background, my northern accent, and my Aspergers could be a reasonable explanation. Ah! Yes, I can guess which one of those three is the reason people found you difficult.

I also suspect its the classic South/North Bias. The Watford and south mob simply cannot handle Geordie, or Scots.

Good that we both got there.

Re: I thought I was being ‘blacklisted’, so I demanded to see colleagues’ emails

#104

Post by solidasparagus »

kire456 wrote: post #38
hycaria wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, what's the point of the article in the first place anyways ? Yeah stuff like that happen, have and will, and sometime verbally so good luck fighting that. Self-improvement seems the most efficient way of fighting that for oneself. I just wanted to remind that the other side of the story was way more probable. Because outcasting her for her accent, despite all the good it brings a team to sprout successful acade…

> Yeah stuff like that happen, have and will, (...) good luck fighting that Fatalism like the kind you suggest adds nothing to the discussion, and indeed to the academic community. It allows bad actors to keep acting badly. An article like this might motivate someone in power to examine whether this kind of conduct occurs in their institution. I don't know about you, but I see a positive expected value. And I am not…

Who you recommend is a reflection on you. If the author is actually difficult to work with and a colleague asks you about the author, not giving an honest answer has negative consequences on your professional reputation.

It doesn't seem like malice to me, particularly since the author seems quite dislikeable based on their article.

Re: I thought I was being ‘blacklisted’, so I demanded to see colleagues’ emails

#105

Post by bena »

AnthonyMouse wrote: post #93
sysbin wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Free will is an illusion and simply it doesn't exist. You cannot make either a choice or decision that's truly your own. Simply, you cannot without being effected by the system you're in. People don't choose the life they're born into and why does anything that comes after birth be assumed differently. The answer cultural conditioning and from religious ideology that has rooted deeply into society. The belief that go…

Let's suppose you're right and non-determinism doesn't exist. (Quantum physics apparently disagrees, but never mind that.) It doesn't matter. Treating people as though they have agency is still necessary, because how we treat them would affect their deterministic state function. If someone commits murder and we say it was only a product of their environment and they have no agency, therefore we shouldn't punish them,…

Also, the paradox is that it doesn't matter one bit whether free will exists or not.

Because either it does and we are making conscious choices and everything that normally follows with that. Or it doesn't and everything we say, do, and think is predetermined.

However, if that's the case, then you are predetermined to be someone to be swayed by certain arguments. You are predetermined to either believe or not in free will. And you cannot change that. Because even if this convinces you one way or the other, I had no choice in typing it, and you had no choice in reading it. This was going to happen based on whatever determines things.

So free will not existing wouldn't change anything. Because some people are predetermined to believe that regardless of the reason, murderers should be punished.

Re: I thought I was being ‘blacklisted’, so I demanded to see colleagues’ emails

#106

Post by inetknght »

sp332 wrote: post #57
traderjane wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Whisper networks just mean powerful people who talk among each other and do their research. That will always be the case. In politics isn’t that just the standard form of discourse?

Whisper networks are less-powerful people warning each other about more-powerful people. People with power don't need to hide their communications so much because they are less vulnerable.

> People with power don't need to hide their communications so much because they are less vulnerable.

That's a dangerously naive way of thinking about communications.

Re: I thought I was being ‘blacklisted’, so I demanded to see colleagues’ emails

#107

Post by carapace »

GordonS wrote: post #20

> I was able to ask my PhD college, and several other institutions, to see all emails in which my name appeared in either the subject line or the body of the email Hmm, I don't think I like this, and I don't understand how the GDPR allows you to do this. While I understand that stored emails that mention you are technically "data about you", I wouldn't consider them "your data". Emails are a form of personal communic…

I usually think about this issue in relation to driving: Do we (society) have the right to your driving performance data? In other words, if your car knows you drive like a reckless idiot should it "narc" on you?

- - - -

It seems to me that this sort of request means that our mental models of email have to change. This is incumbent anyway: most people still think email is private, when in fact it's more like postcards, in that anyone who handles it can read it. The misbegotten idea that you have any digital privacy in the absence of proper encryption has to die. (I don't like it, and am not advocating for it, I'm just calling it like I see it.)

Re: I thought I was being ‘blacklisted’, so I demanded to see colleagues’ emails

#109

Post by newvoiceoldphne »

carapace wrote: post #95
traderjane wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But a posture of honesty appears too expensive even for the Chinese ruling party; how much more power do you need?

Not a good example, Communism abrogates spirituality. It's intrinsically barren and illegitimate. The CCP, founded on a lie, can never afford the truth. And, indeed, we find them trying to maintain a fabricated history to maintain their power. (The "incident" in the Square, the name of Taiwan, and so on.) Generally, there is a correlation between personal power and integrity.

Not sure why you got downvoted. It's an honest observation.

Re: I thought I was being ‘blacklisted’, so I demanded to see colleagues’ emails

#110

Post by mywittyname »

matthewheath wrote: post #64
lordfoom wrote: post #2

An interesting outcome of the GPDR! Does the author have any recourse? Can they sue?

Yes, they can sue – anyone can sue for anything, after all. Would they win? Maybe, but the cost would probably not be worth it and of course there's the reputational damage caused by being seen as someone willing to litigate against their employer / university, etc.

At this point, they seem to be rather close to the bottom anyway. So their best option probably involves self-employment related to their field of study. A settlement can go a long way towards financing their endeavor.
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