Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

H-1B: Federal judge backs government’s narrower view of ‘specialty occupation’

mercurynews.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

31–40 of 235 posts

Re: H-1B: Federal judge backs government’s narrower view of ‘specialty occupation’

#31

Post by Old_Thrashbarg »

privateSFacct wrote: post #4

Ugh, these cases give H1B's a bad name. I do wish there was crackdown on crap like this. Where I work the H1B applicants (who don't get selected) have masters, from a US university, for a degree that applies specifically to their job. These folks should be on the red carpet to US citizenship. They have checked every box. Instead they get treated like crap. They should SHUT DOWN these other players who clog up the pro…

> They should SHUT DOWN these other players who clog up the process.

Or we could focus on making the process uncloggable and work towards the free movement of labor which could add $78T to the global GDP.

https://www.economist.com/the-world-if/2017/07/13/a-world-of...

Re: H-1B: Federal judge backs government’s narrower view of ‘specialty occupation’

#32

Post by davidw »

ergothus wrote: post #15
privateSFacct wrote: post #4

Ugh, these cases give H1B's a bad name. I do wish there was crackdown on crap like this. Where I work the H1B applicants (who don't get selected) have masters, from a US university, for a degree that applies specifically to their job. These folks should be on the red carpet to US citizenship. They have checked every box. Instead they get treated like crap. They should SHUT DOWN these other players who clog up the pro…

As a baseline, I'm in favor of a lot of immigration and think people have way too many hoops to jump through in general, but the H1B crowd in particular is a group that matches even what most of those opposed to mass immigration claim to desire in immigrants. That said, i've noticed different "worlds" of H1B worlds, with different impacts upon other workers. I did a govt job on the US East Coast (Richmond, VA) that h…

The 'root cause' problem in the 1st case is the leverage the employee has over the person. The workers are just trying to better their lot in life, like many of our own ancestors who came to the US. I don't hold any illusions that whoever it was that came over from Ireland in my family was some kind of exceptional talent. Probably just an ordinary person willing to take some risks and work hard.

Re: H-1B: Federal judge backs government’s narrower view of ‘specialty occupation’

#33

Post by Terr_ »

nerdponx wrote: post #17
ergothus wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a baseline, I'm in favor of a lot of immigration and think people have way too many hoops to jump through in general, but the H1B crowd in particular is a group that matches even what most of those opposed to mass immigration claim to desire in immigrants. That said, i've noticed different "worlds" of H1B worlds, with different impacts upon other workers. I did a govt job on the US East Coast (Richmond, VA) that h…

I don't even understand the point of H-1B being tied to a specific employer or job title.

I imagine it's to deter a certain kind of exploit. Hiring Quantum Rocket Surgeons and a week later they're Surface Hygiene Associates being paid much much less. Or vice-versa.

Re: H-1B: Federal judge backs government’s narrower view of ‘specialty occupation’

#34

Post by yazan94 »

nerdponx wrote: post #17
ergothus wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a baseline, I'm in favor of a lot of immigration and think people have way too many hoops to jump through in general, but the H1B crowd in particular is a group that matches even what most of those opposed to mass immigration claim to desire in immigrants. That said, i've noticed different "worlds" of H1B worlds, with different impacts upon other workers. I did a govt job on the US East Coast (Richmond, VA) that h…

I don't even understand the point of H-1B being tied to a specific employer or job title.

I think the idea is that the H1B isnt a general 'work visa', it is given because there is a position at a company for a worker with a specific skillset. So it makes sense in that framework. I'm not arguing that this is the right way, just what the reason probably is.

Re: H-1B: Federal judge backs government’s narrower view of ‘specialty occupation’

#35

Post by nullspace »

throwaway082729 wrote: post #19
wharnal wrote: post #14

> Sagarwala, according to the ruling in Washington, D.C. U.S. District Court, received an H-1B visa in 2012, but those visas are tied to specific employers. So when she sought to change jobs in August last year, the prospective new employer, outsourcing firm HSK Technologies, had to go through the visa application process again. So she had lived in the US for six years and still had to beg the government for permissi…

I've been here for 17+ years, earn $650k/yr and I'm still in the same boat. I'm at the mercy of the govt. if I want to change jobs. Moreover, I need to restart the labor certification process and reapply for my green card though I get to keep the same priority date. There's no end in sight i.e. I cannot predict when I'll get my green card due to the per-country cap and backlog. Worse, I cannot quit and take time off…

Honestly, with that kind of salary - it feels like you could save up enough to get to an EB-5 investors category, which have far shorter waiting times, correct?

Or am I mistaken?

Re: H-1B: Federal judge backs government’s narrower view of ‘specialty occupation’

#36

Post by paxys »

duxup wrote: post #28

I'd really just like to see some sort of minimum pay that is relatively high so that is these are roles that are something the company feels strong enough to shell out the money. $120k? Something like that?

$120k qualifies for low income benefits in San Francisco, so yeah that's not going to matter.

Re: H-1B: Federal judge backs government’s narrower view of ‘specialty occupation’

#37

Post by yazan94 »

koolba wrote: post #21
yholio wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There should be only one parameter that governs the eligibility to specialist visas: the ability to earn a high wage. Companies should bid directly with the salary, and the top X offers get a Visa; the candidate is free to change jobs but is required to maintain within that wage band for the duration of the visa, outside exceptional situations. Any other mechanism affords the opportunity for arbitrage, bureaucracy, l…

What's awesome about this approach is that it naturally leads to max revenue for the government as well. The only counter I've heard to it is that Joe's Tech Corp in Podunk, USA cannot compete with big city salaries and would never be able to get any filled. Though I see that as a feature not a bug.

Why would that be a feature not a bug? The Amazons, Googles, and Goldman Sachs of the US aren't the only companies that need talent.

Re: H-1B: Federal judge backs government’s narrower view of ‘specialty occupation’

#38

Post by opportune »

yazan94 wrote: post #29

TL;DR: The student was denied an H1B for a QA Tester role, which requires a BS in a computer-related field. The argument was that this qualifies as a specialty occupation. The judge rightfully told her to pound sand. @privateSFacct has a good point - there are plenty of international students that get their masters degree here in America and they should definitely be getting better treatment. I really don't think tha…

Americans don't need to get masters/phds to get high-paying jobs in the US, because we don't need them for the immigration benefits.

In most STEM fields, an MS has very little functional benefits. Oftentimes, it's the same with a PhD. In fact if you account for the tuition cost (of an MS) + opportunity cost (lost income and lost advancement) they can be net negatives.

> really don't think that there are any actual jobs that require nothing more than a BS degree and can be honestly considered for an H1B

Uh, software engineering? I know many people with only BS's in CS, Math, or Physics who are better than most people with MS's or even PhDs. I think nursing might also be valid (though that is more credential-based, we still need BSNs).

Re: H-1B: Federal judge backs government’s narrower view of ‘specialty occupation’

#39

Post by usaphp »

throwaway082729 wrote: post #19
wharnal wrote: post #14

> Sagarwala, according to the ruling in Washington, D.C. U.S. District Court, received an H-1B visa in 2012, but those visas are tied to specific employers. So when she sought to change jobs in August last year, the prospective new employer, outsourcing firm HSK Technologies, had to go through the visa application process again. So she had lived in the US for six years and still had to beg the government for permissi…

I've been here for 17+ years, earn $650k/yr and I'm still in the same boat. I'm at the mercy of the govt. if I want to change jobs. Moreover, I need to restart the labor certification process and reapply for my green card though I get to keep the same priority date. There's no end in sight i.e. I cannot predict when I'll get my green card due to the per-country cap and backlog. Worse, I cannot quit and take time off…

Why not get an investor visa? It's easily convertible to green card according to several people I know who did it. You only need $500K or so for the whole thing. And investment money were returned even with some profit.

Re: H-1B: Federal judge backs government’s narrower view of ‘specialty occupation’

#40

Post by Mountain_Skies »

koolba wrote: post #21
yholio wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There should be only one parameter that governs the eligibility to specialist visas: the ability to earn a high wage. Companies should bid directly with the salary, and the top X offers get a Visa; the candidate is free to change jobs but is required to maintain within that wage band for the duration of the visa, outside exceptional situations. Any other mechanism affords the opportunity for arbitrage, bureaucracy, l…

What's awesome about this approach is that it naturally leads to max revenue for the government as well. The only counter I've heard to it is that Joe's Tech Corp in Podunk, USA cannot compete with big city salaries and would never be able to get any filled. Though I see that as a feature not a bug.

Not all tech workers are created equal and not all companies need tech rock stars. Joe's Tech Corp would be priced out of the H1B market but could still compete for talent in the citizen pool. Different talent levels come with different compensation requirements.

I'm trying to come up with the most charitable interpretation of your last sentence but am failing. Was it meant as a "let them eat cake" statement for not being a coastal dweller? Given the many negative effects tech centers are having on local populations, deconcentrating tech across the country seems like it would have positive benefits for many not in the tech industry, which is most people.

Post reply on HN