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Google Protest Leader Leaves

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Re: Google Protest Leader Leaves

#191

Post by fourthark »

KirinDave wrote: post #87
lawnchair_larry wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Looks good for Google to me. These protests were getting out of hand, and their demands were showing some major entitlement.

You don't understand Google culture if you think this line would fly with anyone there. Entitlement for full time employees is baked into the charter, along with transparency. That's a good thing and a bad thing, in different ways. It gave bad actors a lot of autonomy, but it also exposed them to scrutiny and pushback from good actors. What's surprising is that now these reprisals are trying to push that back to make…

This is the big point.

It's true that it is not normal for employees to be able to speak against their company (or express strong opinions publicly).

Yet Google has always prided itself on being different in having outspoken employees.

This is why it looks bad for Google when it's just business as usual everywhere else.

Re: Google Protest Leader Leaves

#192

Post by CydeWeys »

KUcxrAVrtI wrote: post #180
SolaceQuantum wrote: post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Protesting a lack of good general harassment handling shouldn't be considered trouble making behavior. The sexual harassment is trouble making and it was rewarded with hush money.

They are specifically being targeted for forcing google out of China according to the article. It was fine as long as they were merely targeting social issues within google.

¿Por que no los dos?

Re: Google Protest Leader Leaves

#193

Post by 303space »

charliesharding wrote: post #47

I don't really understand why it's surprising to anyone that they would face "internal retaliation" after exposing their employer as evil and boycott worthy to the entire world. By publicizing it to the degree that they did and attaching their name to it, they were putting their interests over the company. If my company started doing business practices that I didn't approve of, I would try my hardest to change the di…

I think it’s actually a very savvy strategy to protest from within. It’s too easy for Google to shrug off or ignore public criticism. They’ve done this for decades with virtually no repercussions because they hold a monopoly on their core business - very few people are going to ‘delete Google’ no matter how much you disagree with their policies.

They do not have a monopoly on talent and they are actually fearful of being no longer seen as the #1 workplace option for top candidates. Protesting as a Google employee gives you much more leverage than an outsider will ever have (unless you have the $$ to buy off a handful of senators).

Re: Google Protest Leader Leaves

#194

Post by r3bl »

SpicyLemonZest wrote: post #92
mffnbs wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you implying that their actions cannot be gender biased?

I mean, they can be, but is there any reason to believe they are? Have male leaders of similar protests been treated better? Surely it's not right to infer gender bias just because the victims are women.

> I mean, they can be, but is there any reason to believe they are?

Yes, there is: women stepped forward.

> Have male leaders of similar protests been treated better?

Men either haven't experienced the same, or they are keeping their mouth shut.

In both scenarios, women should be supported. If men step forward, so should they. They didn't so far (or at least, not in large enough numbers for such a protest to be reported), so based on the data we have available to us, the problem affects women way more than it affects men.

Re: Google Protest Leader Leaves

#195

Post by KirinDave »

kpU8efre7r wrote: post #112
KirinDave wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's literally illegal. There are laws against retaliation against whistleblowers. That is why it is surprising. > I don't understand the desire to stay with a company and accept paychecks while simultaneously publicly denouncing and leading protests against them. Because you don't want to see the thing you worked so hard to build misused to build killer robots and "war minds"? Seems reasonable to me. Google's got a…

What laws? Source for that please.

Are you perhaps forgetting that this person was involved in organizing the women's march? Do I actually need to find a source for US law suggesting that retaliation against women reporting sexism is in fact illegal?

This is basic compliance training for any US employment, and the EU has similar laws. Where do you live and work that you don't know this?

Re: Google Protest Leader Leaves

#196

Post by Frondo »

mkoryak wrote: post #118
spamizbad wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But your work is innately political.

what is political about this? for(const i = 0; i < 100; i++) { ... }

mkoryak, your task today is to write us a for-loop that lets us isolate people conducting protected workplace organizing so we can fire them.

Re: Google Protest Leader Leaves

#197

Post by ehvatum »

“Whittaker also publicly denounced some Google decisions, including the appointment of Kay Coles James, a conservative think tank leader, to an AI ethics board. Google soon nixed the board.”

Many people hold strong beliefs that conflict with the strong beliefs of others and engage in open debate rather than walk-outs. I can only assume Whittaker realized that her views would not prevail, but felt that she was nonetheless in the right, and therefore resorted to alternative means of pressing her point.

Re: Google Protest Leader Leaves

#198

Post by KirinDave »

gizmo686 wrote: post #135
KirinDave wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This couldn't ever work. Folks that smart want to do things that are real.

Real != profitable. Google can offer academic style oppurtunities at industry style salaries. Eg. Fuchsia OS might have been started because Google saw a bussines oppurtunity in writing an open source capabilities OS. Or, it might have been started to keep smart OS engineers from leaving the company.

It seems fairly ridiculous to suggest that Fuchsia is not a real project. It wouldn't be the first OS Google has built.

Re: Google Protest Leader Leaves

#199

Post by leftyted »

There are two narratives:

1. These people are rabble-rousers who will never be happy and are disrupting the work environment at Google.

2. These people are highlighting legitimate problems within the company and are trying to enact positive change.

Take your pick. But be aware of both narratives. And be aware that neither of them is unreasonable.

Re: Google Protest Leader Leaves

#200

Post by UncleMeat »

lawnchair_larry wrote: post #23
AdmiralAsshat wrote: post #13

I thought this story had already been reported a month ago. But no, I was wrong, that was the other organizer of the Google Protests, Claire Stapleton: https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2019/jun/07/google-wa... So to clarify, both of the female Google employees who lead/organized the protests have now left because they say they faced retaliation. That looks very bad for Google.

Looks good for Google to me. These protests were getting out of hand, and their demands were showing some major entitlement.

"Don't pay out millions of dollars to people who were asked to quietly resign after harassing employees" is major entitlement?
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