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How many kinds of USB-C to USB-C cables are there?

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Re: How many kinds of USB-C to USB-C cables are there?

#161

Post by jarfil »

rhinoceraptor wrote: post #130
Dylan16807 wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Exactly! We can call the one for small peripherals "USB", the one for monitors "VGA", the one for networking "ethernet", the one for power "AC"... I suspect most users can figure out how to manage that. Wrong kind of names. For these cables, all you should need to know is a speed rating. And they almost work that way, but the ball got dropped in a few places and the cables are badly labeled, so it turns into a nigh…

Also, barrel jacks don't have just one polarity. I learned that the hard way when I fried my guitar amp as a kid.

They usually have the polarity written down, in a tiny font on a label back down on the charger. That's why I always put labels on barrel connectors, since the manufacturers can't be bothered.

Re: How many kinds of USB-C to USB-C cables are there?

#162

Post by Mirioron »

krick wrote: post #93
bobthepanda wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even better, why not just make incompatible cables impossible to intermix by, say, using different ports ?

Well, cables in question are mostly backwards-compatible, so as long as it would actually transition forward, the prospect of using a single ultimative cable with any device with identical ports seems actually nice. The problem is not that USB-C is a bad standard trying to combine too much in a single port, the problem is that there are multiple different cables absolutely identical from the outside at one time on th…

It only seems like a nice idea if you don't care about efficiency. If your tool can do all the things then it's going to be a very expensive tool (or will suck) compared to something that's specialized.

Re: How many kinds of USB-C to USB-C cables are there?

#163

Post by Mirioron »

sahaskatta wrote: post #119

Another really shocking thing I recently discovered was the maximum length on a USB cable. USB 2.0 supports a max of 5 meters (~16 feet). Meanwhile a USB 3.0 cable only offers a max length of 3 meters.

And since USB 4 will be Thunder Bolt, expect cable length to become even shorter.

Re: How many kinds of USB-C to USB-C cables are there?

#164

Post by beaugunderson »

manacit wrote: post #70
Ductapemaster wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Out of curiosity, what USB-C dock do you have? I am in the market for one.

I (and a number of people I know) have a CalDigit TS3+ and it's worked extremely well for me: https://www.caldigit.com/ts3-plus I can't speak to what else is on the market, but there's not more I'd want from this.

Damn, it looks perfect except that it can't do 4k @ 144hz (but to be fair I haven't found a hub that can, only one-off USB-C to DP connectors).

Re: How many kinds of USB-C to USB-C cables are there?

#165

Post by rangibaby »

jwr wrote: post #157
jrochkind1 wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why don't they give NAMES to these different types of cables? They seem to have either no names or too many names where it's unclear what is intended for the consumer. Just giving the cable a clear name (in words, not icons), so you could know what you were buying, and a device could say "you need this kind of cable", and a person could write a blog saying "to support DP-Alt-Mode you need X kind of cable" and all use…

> Why don't they give NAMES to these different types of cables? The whole catchy idea behind USB-C (unfortunately perpetuated here by people who should know better) is that there is ONE SOCKET, ONE PLUG and ONE CABLE. Oh, the dream of using a single connector. Unfortunately, this is far from reality and the result is a complete mess, which is why I'm not a big fan of the whole USB-C thing. Especially given that I'm a…

> Unfortunately, this is far from reality and the result is a complete mess, which is why I'm not a big fan of the whole USB-C thing. Especially given that I'm a hostage, because a certain computer company whose computers generally suck the least, decided to show courage by moving to USB-C even though the ecosystem is nowhere near mature — let's put pressure on the manufacturers by getting hostages (oops, "users") on board.

I still remember when the iMac came out with two USB ports, a CD drive, and nothing else. It was a couple of years too early, or did it prove that you could make a successful computer without vital things like a parallel port and a floppy drive?

Re: How many kinds of USB-C to USB-C cables are there?

#166

Post by Dunedan »

AceJohnny2 wrote: post #113
Dylan16807 wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not true! Active thunderbolt 3 cables often only support thunderbolt 3.

Per the Thunderbolt FAQ [1] > What is Thunderbolt 3? > Computer ports with Thunderbolt 3 provide 40Gbps Thunderbolt – double the speed of the previous generation, USB 3.1 10Gbps, and DisplayPort 1.2 . I'm curious: which active cable did you use that didn't support DP? [1] https://thunderbolttechnology.net/tech/faq

What you quote is not related at all to what Thunderbolt cables support beside Thunderbolt. It just states that you can use Thunderbolt to transmit DisplayPort signals. By that you're utilizing the Thunderbolt alternate mode to tunnel DisplayPort signals, instead of using the DisplayPort alternate mode [1]. Using Thunderbolt to transmit DisplayPort signals only works with devices which support Thunderbolt, not with screens supporting "just" DisplayPort. To make confusion even worse: All existing Thunderbolt controllers also support the DisplayPort alternate mode, so a lot of people who believe they're using Thunderbolt are probably just using the DisplayPort alternate mode instead. Afaik Thunderbolt cables usually support both, but I'm not sure if that's mandated somehow.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USB-C#Alternate_Mode_partner_s...

Re: How many kinds of USB-C to USB-C cables are there?

#167

Post by U8dcN7vx »

derefr wrote: post #57
starsinspace wrote: post #42

After buying a screen which has only a USB-C DP-Alt-Mode input, I was recently in the market for a matching cable. My only requirements were “it should be as long as possible, at least 2 meters” and “it needs to support DP-Alt-Mode”. Now I thought this would be easy, just ask Google what kind of cable I need, right...? Well... no. Not at all. I wasn’t able to find any information whatsoever what kind of USB-C cable i…

The answer is supposed to be easy; it's "you need to buy one of those really expensive USB-C Thunderbolt 3 cables, because those cables—the ones that do everything—are supposed to be the only type of USB-C cables." USB-C cables are supposed to be universal, i.e. have all the features, all the time; and thus, USB-C cables should (in 2019) be very expensive. Any USB-C cable that isn't very expensive (in 2019) isn't fol…

I detected sarcasm. I'm not sure if that's just me or the other respondents so far have mislaid their detectors.

Re: How many kinds of USB-C to USB-C cables are there?

#168

Post by TeMPOraL »

jwr wrote: post #157
jrochkind1 wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why don't they give NAMES to these different types of cables? They seem to have either no names or too many names where it's unclear what is intended for the consumer. Just giving the cable a clear name (in words, not icons), so you could know what you were buying, and a device could say "you need this kind of cable", and a person could write a blog saying "to support DP-Alt-Mode you need X kind of cable" and all use…

> Why don't they give NAMES to these different types of cables? The whole catchy idea behind USB-C (unfortunately perpetuated here by people who should know better) is that there is ONE SOCKET, ONE PLUG and ONE CABLE. Oh, the dream of using a single connector. Unfortunately, this is far from reality and the result is a complete mess, which is why I'm not a big fan of the whole USB-C thing. Especially given that I'm a…

I wish USB-C mandated one cable. Just one. If you cut anything out of it, if you did anything out of spec, it's not a valid USB-C cable anymore. You either have all features, or no features.

There's nothing benefiting customers from this cable mess. It only enables dishonest businesses, as customers can't tell cables apart until they plug them in and try to use them.

Re: How many kinds of USB-C to USB-C cables are there?

#169

Post by TeMPOraL »

derefr wrote: post #76
ben-schaaf wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> USB-C cables are supposed to be universal I may be wrong here, but from what I understand this doesn't seem to be the case (DP, Thunderbolt, etc. are all "optional"). It would also mean that all cables would be limited to 50cm.

There was the design intent, and then there was the final standard. The USB-IF is composed of manufacturers that wanted to be able to cheap out on cables; so of course they made all the expensive features optional, at the expense of anything USB-C was designed to accomplish. In an alternate world where USB-IF was headed by a benevolent-dictator-for-life, USB-C wouldn't have any optional features. (It'd also be in nea…

> (It'd also be in nearly nothing, because no manufacturer would want to pay the BOM costs of supporting it.)

It'd be everywhere if manufacturers had no other choice. Mass production would keep the price low.

In that reality, Apple would be actually courageous for switching to USB-C and forcing everyone's hand. The EU could jump in to, and tell phone manufacturers that if they want to switch away from plain old USB, they can switch over to USB-C, but no going back to proprietary connectors bullshit. This would be a much nicer world indeed.

Re: How many kinds of USB-C to USB-C cables are there?

#170

Post by ben-schaaf »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #168
jwr wrote: post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Why don't they give NAMES to these different types of cables? The whole catchy idea behind USB-C (unfortunately perpetuated here by people who should know better) is that there is ONE SOCKET, ONE PLUG and ONE CABLE. Oh, the dream of using a single connector. Unfortunately, this is far from reality and the result is a complete mess, which is why I'm not a big fan of the whole USB-C thing. Especially given that I'm a…

I wish USB-C mandated one cable. Just one. If you cut anything out of it, if you did anything out of spec, it's not a valid USB-C cable anymore. You either have all features, or no features. There's nothing benefiting customers from this cable mess. It only enables dishonest businesses, as customers can't tell cables apart until they plug them in and try to use them.

That would certainly mean cutting features. Thunderbolt limits the length of the cable to ~50cm, but that's way too short for a power cord.
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