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Apple begins exporting India-made iPhones to European markets

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Re: Apple begins exporting India-made iPhones to European markets

#111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

India has plenty of water. The problem plaguing South India, specifically Chennai, was anticipated. The central government was fixing it. However it lacked sufficient support from the state government.

Chennai is sitting next to a Ocean and has sunshine 95% of the days. If they can't figure the solution to their water crisis it is due to their politicians.

Desalination is not a panacea.

Re: Apple begins exporting India-made iPhones to European markets

#112
Just an aside: one thing people who harp on India's population problem seem to miss is that the fertility rates in India are on a steady downward trend. Indeed, it's below replacement level in several Indian states. See here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_states_and_union_terri... . The literacy rates too are improving ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Literacy_in_India) as are the poverty levels (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poverty_in_India). It's no coincidence that India's poorest states are also its most populous and also most illiterate. They also happen to wield the most political power in India.

The trouble is that India has a social bootstrapping problem. India's governance depends on the leaders Indians elect, which means that the electorate sets the policy followed by the leaders. And this electorate is largely poor and illiterate. This means that vastly sub-optimal policies get followed than what would be ideal. Often religious, casteist and nationalistic tropes are an easier sell than those based on science, commonsense and reason. But it also has the advantage that draconian policies that oppress the citizens don't get implemented.

Re: Apple begins exporting India-made iPhones to European markets

#113

I have mixed feelings about the move of manufacturing to India. Whilst I would like Indians to be economically successful I can't ignore the ecological disaster that is happening in their country. It is absolutely terrifying. The air in Mumbai was unbreathable when I visited and it wasn't even ranking remotely near the top in the most polluted city air in India at the time (Delhi's was 3x as bad). Adding to this the…

Let's use your reasons, but look at it from the opposite side: 1) The largest contributor to the poor air quality in India is the practice of burning to clear fields, cook stoves that use wood, and the burning of cow dung [ https://www.vox.com/2018/5/8/17316978/india-pollution-levels... ]. One easy way to bring these people out of poverty is to provide them with good economic opportunities (like factory jobs!). High-…

I remember reading a study that said this was not caused by poverty, at least not alone. It's also cultural. There are poorer areas in the world where they don't "burn to clear fields, cook stove with wood and burn cow dung" and also open defecation. At least that's what the study said, and that people doing these weren't all particularly poor. It would require a huge cultural shift and change of habits. Something that is really hard to do unfortunately.

Re: Apple begins exporting India-made iPhones to European markets

#115
It's possible without being patronising or racist to say that India needs to follow a different model of development than the western one. In fact, that idea was central to the Gandhian independence struggle - just read the great man's Hind Swaraj!

There are many reasons for doing so. For one, we don't have colonies we can screw over - i.e., India's India - while enriching ourselves. Assuming we would want to do that at all.

We also don't have the window of opportunity that China had for becoming a manufacturing hub. That's been done and while we can compete for a percentage of the spoils, it will never be the gold rush that took manufacturing to China. The politics of globalization alone will ensure that.

Second, we don't have the luxury of several decades of uninterrupted "development" before thinking about the environment. Climate change is going to hit us hard well before that, and one look at the water crisis should tell you that the basic necessities of life will need to be carefully managed.

I have nothing against assembling iPhones in Bangalore. Or becoming the world capital of CRISPR technologies. However, those can't become the driving forces of a future India. We need to think boldly beyond those constraints. I am not saying returning to a romantic conception of an ideal past, but a detour around the mess that industrial capitalism is already creating and will continue to create if we don't think of alternatives.

Re: Apple begins exporting India-made iPhones to European markets

#116

Just an aside: one thing people who harp on India's population problem seem to miss is that the fertility rates in India are on a steady downward trend. Indeed, it's below replacement level in several Indian states. See here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_states_and_union_terri... . The literacy rates too are improving ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Literacy_in_India ) as are the poverty levels ( https://en.…

Is that “an aside” or just off-topic? Come on

Re: Apple begins exporting India-made iPhones to European markets

#117

I have mixed feelings about the move of manufacturing to India. Whilst I would like Indians to be economically successful I can't ignore the ecological disaster that is happening in their country. It is absolutely terrifying. The air in Mumbai was unbreathable when I visited and it wasn't even ranking remotely near the top in the most polluted city air in India at the time (Delhi's was 3x as bad). Adding to this the…

Western concerns imposed on developing countries is not a good idea. Life here is safe and sound for us to think about climate change and other things. When people in India don't even have clean water or electricity they shouldn't give a shit about environment or other things. It took the US 200 years of development before it started working about these things. And the US is / was a developed nation.

Not giving a shit about the environment isn't such a great way to get clean water.

Re: Apple begins exporting India-made iPhones to European markets

#118

Just an aside: one thing people who harp on India's population problem seem to miss is that the fertility rates in India are on a steady downward trend. Indeed, it's below replacement level in several Indian states. See here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_states_and_union_terri... . The literacy rates too are improving ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Literacy_in_India ) as are the poverty levels ( https://en.…

Very analogous to China.

The wealthy south is a political wasteland despite all notions of "powerful southerners running things," while Henan has has mere county level cadres on the committee (an extremely unlikely posting)

In is both a blessing and a curse that the political process happens largely outside of here.

Re: Apple begins exporting India-made iPhones to European markets

#119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let's use your reasons, but look at it from the opposite side: 1) The largest contributor to the poor air quality in India is the practice of burning to clear fields, cook stoves that use wood, and the burning of cow dung [ https://www.vox.com/2018/5/8/17316978/india-pollution-levels... ]. One easy way to bring these people out of poverty is to provide them with good economic opportunities (like factory jobs!). High-…

This is super accurate. Fyi - new Delhi has the most stringent vehicular regulations in India. All commercial vehicles in Delhi run on natural gas - both petrol and diesel are banned. India's pollution levels are not industrial or vehicular - they are agriculture waste burning. And they are timed with agricultural harvesting cycles. We have super fragmented farmlands who are really poor and this causes bad practices…

Is that really true? Delhi has banned "registration" of such vehicles sure, but vehicles from nearby states (Haryana, Punjab, UP) and others are aplenty on the roads and allowed to fill petrol or diesel. Yes the ban has led to significant impact just pointing out that significant sources of air pollution remain.

Re: Apple begins exporting India-made iPhones to European markets

#120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This isn't quite the truth. In fact, I'd say that everything has kind of stalled in India. Real estate development has stalled, the auto industry is in a downward spiral (8 consecutive months of negative growth; sales down almost 25% YoY), and demand for consumer electronics is dwindling. There's a credit crunch thanks to banks getting rid of non performing assets. Add to that, there's a shortage of water.

Certainly didn't feel like it in Pune. New towns are mushrooming up along the highway like there's no tomorrow.

Pune, I reckon, is one of those boom towns since so many corporates are moving there because Bengaluru and Mumbai are too overcrowded.

But the car sales slump, at least, is very well documented. There's been a drastic fall in demand and everyone is bandying about myriad reasons (fuel prices, ridesharing, etc.). I just think people don't have enough money

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