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The death watch for the X Window System has probably started

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21–30 of 518 posts

Re: The death watch for the X Window System has probably started

#21

Is there any plan by Wayland to incorporate ssh forwarding? Last I heard it wasn't in the cards, and I think that feature is useful enough; it's probably the only feature I really would miss.

Waypipe does this in a really similar way to x forwarding.

https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/mstoeckl/waypipe/

Re: The death watch for the X Window System has probably started

#22
post #2

Omae wa mou shindeiru. If the future of X is uncertain, then X is already dead. No one wants to base their OS on something without a clear maintenance and development roadmap.

Except for those who pave the way. Not all OSes are products.

Re: The death watch for the X Window System has probably started

#23

Is there any plan by Wayland to incorporate ssh forwarding? Last I heard it wasn't in the cards, and I think that feature is useful enough; it's probably the only feature I really would miss.

It appears that one person is working on it and the project is in a prototype phase: https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/emersion/waypipe

Re: The death watch for the X Window System has probably started

#24
My take home from this thread now with a few weeks to reflect is that if we want a real window manager that is maintained, then it will have to be a community effort. This will be hard because training an involvement with x11 has been left entirely to Red Hat too long. It will be a lot of work and money to transfer knowledge from the few who do know it.

With this in mind, are there other projects that are at risk due to stewardship by a single corporation? How can we prevent this in the future?

Re: The death watch for the X Window System has probably started

#25
post #7

Are there any major x11 features that wayland lacks other than remote operation over a network? I think at one point it locked the refresh rate to 60hz, has that been changed?

Remote operation over the network is actively worked on via Waypipe, seemed to work pretty well for me.

https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/mstoeckl/waypipe/

Re: The death watch for the X Window System has probably started

#26

Is there any plan by Wayland to incorporate ssh forwarding? Last I heard it wasn't in the cards, and I think that feature is useful enough; it's probably the only feature I really would miss.

I see this a lot and now I need to ask: do you actually use it and find it usable?

Every time I've tried it, it was plagued with problems (fonts, HiDPI issues, different environments) and horrible performance. I mostly had to resort back to NX, which is okish, but not better at all than Windows' RDP or better VNC solutions. So what's the big draw here?

Re: The death watch for the X Window System has probably started

#27
post #2

Omae wa mou shindeiru. If the future of X is uncertain, then X is already dead. No one wants to base their OS on something without a clear maintenance and development roadmap.

Except for those who pave the way. Not all OSes are products.

I'm not sure that use of X11 could be considered "paving the way"

Re: The death watch for the X Window System has probably started

#28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Universal keybinding and screen capture of any kind. Kind of show stoppers for people who actually use their window manager for managing windows.

I use screen capture and remote operation every day. Are those features planned?

I don't use remote operation (as imagined by X11) at all. But I do use non-X11 screen-sharing systems all the time.

Ask yourself, "why do all of the major GUI systems - in daily use by billions of people, evolved over the past 40 years - opt to offer remote operation only as an optional add-on?"

Maintainers, beware of the tail wagging the dog!

Re: The death watch for the X Window System has probably started

#29

Sway has become one of my favorite pieces of software. The only issue is that Sway or Wayland seems to have trouble implementing an easy to use redshift/nightlight. Based on my research into eye strain and talking to my optometrist I keep redshift on 24/7 and I can’t go back.

If you call redshift before calling sway, it works for me. I have it always on and just give it a value.

redshift -m drm -PO 3000

sway

Re: The death watch for the X Window System has probably started

#30
post #17
post #7

Are there any major x11 features that wayland lacks other than remote operation over a network? I think at one point it locked the refresh rate to 60hz, has that been changed?

Where do we even begin? Windows managers? Consistent window decorations? Thousands of applications? Consistent performance? Redshift? Global keybindings?

> Windows managers?

Sway/wlroots.

> Consistent window decorations?

This is up to individual compositors and toolkits.

> Thousands of applications

Like what? Any that rely on X specific behaviour run via XWayland.

> Consistent performance

Wayland in theory should be faster than X, but again, this depends on compositor.

> Redshift

Gnome has night-light on Wayland already. KDE I think just added it.

> Global keybindings

There are proposals to allow better negotiation of key bindings. But I think it's a bonus that applications can't listen into keys when they're not in focus.

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