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I Opted Out of Facial Recognition at the Airport – It Wasn't Easy

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Re: I Opted Out of Facial Recognition at the Airport – It Wasn't Easy

#161

Post by JadeNB »

pelario wrote: post #3

Very click-baity. Below the only part that actually relates to the title: The announcement came as we began to board. Last month, I was at Detroit’s Metro Airport for a connecting flight to Southeast Asia. I listened as a Delta Air Lines staff member informed passengers that the boarding process would use facial recognition instead of passport scanners. As a privacy-conscious person, I was uncomfortable boarding this…

> I didn't hear a single announcement alerting passengers how to avoid the face scanners.

> To figure out how to do so, I had to leave the boarding line, speak with a Delta representative at their information desk, get back in line, then request a passport scan when it was my turn to board.

While I agree that it's made as easy as possible to go with the flow, and communicated less clearly than I'd like that you can avoid it, I think that this (the article's presentation, not your post) is disingenuous. I flew from DTW to SYX about 6 months ago, and saw signs (though no announcements) clearly indicating that you could opt out. I simply told the boarding agent when I came to the front of the line that I wanted to opt out; there was no need to leave the line.

(In the interest of full disclosure, I don't know for sure that this works, because they were trying to speed up very delayed boarding and had given up on the facial scanning anyway, so they just waved me past without appearing even to notice that I asked.)

Re: I Opted Out of Facial Recognition at the Airport – It Wasn't Easy

#162

Post by beatgammit »

corodra wrote: post #84

A bit weak of an article. I absolutely hate how facial rec is going to be the norm in a lot of things outside security. 1. The infamous they, already have a picture of your face. Your id/passport. It's kind of too late to be anonymous when boarding a plane, for multiple reasons. 2. One agency has it, thus its easy for them to share it with others. HA! You, have never dealt with fed agencies. You want to meet the grow…

Wait, are you seriously insinuating that it's okay for the government to do this?

Airline security worked fine before 9/11, and it hasn't measurably improved with all of the bull crap the TSA is now doing. From what I can tell, we haven't been attacked in the same way because:

- passengers are more vigilant - terrorist attacks are hard to plan and execute as it is - airlines installed locking doors for the cockpit

All of the rest of the stuff the TSA does is overreach. It's not equivalent to complaining how much sugar is in cake while eating cake, it's closer to only being offered sugary cake while in prison without being told there's a healthier option available.

Re: I Opted Out of Facial Recognition at the Airport – It Wasn't Easy

#163

Post by corodra »

beatgammit wrote: post #162
corodra wrote: post #84

A bit weak of an article. I absolutely hate how facial rec is going to be the norm in a lot of things outside security. 1. The infamous they, already have a picture of your face. Your id/passport. It's kind of too late to be anonymous when boarding a plane, for multiple reasons. 2. One agency has it, thus its easy for them to share it with others. HA! You, have never dealt with fed agencies. You want to meet the grow…

Wait, are you seriously insinuating that it's okay for the government to do this? Airline security worked fine before 9/11, and it hasn't measurably improved with all of the bull crap the TSA is now doing. From what I can tell, we haven't been attacked in the same way because: - passengers are more vigilant - terrorist attacks are hard to plan and execute as it is - airlines installed locking doors for the cockpit Al…

Did I say it was acceptable? Did I use those words? Did I not say that I do not like where its going? At the same time, can I blame anyone for going security overboard when multiple buildings are destroyed by kamikaze hijacked airplanes? A first responder from that just recently died. So yea, still a bit of a sore wound for people. This isn't like talking about Rome getting sacked. Some of us still remember when the towers stood.

Passengers are vigilant. Ha! The one thing your average civilian is not is vigilant. The internet is rife with bad folks doing bad things in crowds. And most people do nothing.

Plus, look up the millennium plot. The news doesn't make a stink when things go well. Lots of people have been stopped at airports and even before being able to start. You only hear about the failures, because it makes for better news.

Fact is, pandora's box was opened. We are in a new age where people get their fame from doing big, nasty things. The Rolling Stone put the Boston bomber's face on the cover for fuck's sake. Where rock star faces have been. I like that on imgur, some people bucked that trend by periodically showing the faces and sharing the stories of those that fought back. But guess what, someone has to actively protect too. Yea, lots of issues with the TSA. They knee jerked hard towards some super fucked up practices those first few years. You think traveling with a really slavic last name was fun? I was always randomly put in the special search line. Three times I got backroom questioned over my recent travels. I still show up 3 hours early to fly out of habit.

But I also chose to roadtrip more often instead. Which was more fun anyways.

Maybe if the public could actually police themselves and evil was eradicated, then we can do away with security in general. Until then, it's a response to a problem where no one is offering a better one other than hugs and unicorns that fart rainbows.

Re: I Opted Out of Facial Recognition at the Airport – It Wasn't Easy

#164

Post by kjar »

dijit wrote: post #147
dalore wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes I asked if I could get a pat down instead of the backscatter x-ray at Heathrow. Was made to feel like a criminal, questioned etc and put under pressure. And then to be told I don't have to get scanned but I can't get on my flight unless I do. There wasn't even an opt out.

Similar story, and I’m going to go ahead and assume that the reason you wouldn’t be able to board was due to the flight departing very soon. I _always_ opt out of backscatter machines. I’m British so I’ve flown Heathrow and Gatwick and Luton (etc), normally the process is painless. I wait a fair while longer than others, sitting/standing publicly as people pass me by and it feels awkward, but not enough to stop me. I…

I ‘opt out’ always. Had a terminal security person tell me it’s just air (what in the actual funk!?). Fruitless attempts to explain that claim was entirely incorrect I just gave up. Got the pat down and move alongit’s a pain but flying is terrible in general. Finally I enjoy making the inconveniences along the way.

Re: I Opted Out of Facial Recognition at the Airport – It Wasn't Easy

#165

Post by simond_d »

steelframe wrote: post #138
simond_d wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nothing you've said here would make me want to go back to 1996 and take a flight, granddad.

Everything he said would make me want to take more flights, you child.

Really? Because many more people fly now than they did in the 90s, must be so horrible for you in this dystopian future we're living in.

Re: I Opted Out of Facial Recognition at the Airport – It Wasn't Easy

#166

Post by simond_d »

scottlocklin wrote: post #94
simond_d wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nothing you've said here would make me want to go back to 1996 and take a flight, granddad.

I guess animals often grow to enjoy their cages; had a pal who kinda freaked out when he got out of the pokey too. Oh yeah: no body cavity searches getting past the gate, we had legroom, free food on the plane, free baggage, and they didn't blare CNN in the airports like some Orwell dystopia, or ads for the airline on the airplane telescreen. The planes were better too; 747 was super common and comfy (now you need to…

Sounds like your issues are related to flying in the states? If you're problem with flying today includes cavity searches and being able to hike up prices by trading tickets then you're probably right, best if you don't fly and we'll all be the better off for it.

What are you talking about with the concorde flights!? They were a lot more expensive than they are today let alone the prices of a normal carrier flight at the time. When was the last time you flew?

Re: I Opted Out of Facial Recognition at the Airport – It Wasn't Easy

#167

Post by OrgNet »

simion314 wrote: post #153
OrgNet wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you wear a mask while they do the passport scan? They need know how you look like so they can match the picture with the passport... using a computer or a human.

That is fine if it would be the same, but your biometric data is stored in a database, I would be fine with scan the passport , scan the person, check if it matches, if all is fine delete the biometric data and not put it in a database. If there is a good reason to keep this data in a database let me know.

How can they compare your appearance to a picture if they don't keep your picture on-file?

Re: I Opted Out of Facial Recognition at the Airport – It Wasn't Easy

#168

Post by simion314 »

OrgNet wrote: post #167
simion314 wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is fine if it would be the same, but your biometric data is stored in a database, I would be fine with scan the passport , scan the person, check if it matches, if all is fine delete the biometric data and not put it in a database. If there is a good reason to keep this data in a database let me know.

How can they compare your appearance to a picture if they don't keep your picture on-file?

The passport is in your hand, you place it on the table where it can be scanned and compared with your face. If they have your face in the database can you travel without a physical passport?

Re: I Opted Out of Facial Recognition at the Airport – It Wasn't Easy

#169

Post by OrgNet »

simion314 wrote: post #168
OrgNet wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How can they compare your appearance to a picture if they don't keep your picture on-file?

The passport is in your hand, you place it on the table where it can be scanned and compared with your face. If they have your face in the database can you travel without a physical passport?

So you could just use a fake passport? Yeah to tell you the truth, I'm not sure why a passport is required... Just like driver licenses and tag registrations, they have all the information on their computers.

Re: I Opted Out of Facial Recognition at the Airport – It Wasn't Easy

#170

Post by dzhiurgis »

sirkneeland wrote: post #102
scottlocklin wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess animals often grow to enjoy their cages; had a pal who kinda freaked out when he got out of the pokey too. Oh yeah: no body cavity searches getting past the gate, we had legroom, free food on the plane, free baggage, and they didn't blare CNN in the airports like some Orwell dystopia, or ads for the airline on the airplane telescreen. The planes were better too; 747 was super common and comfy (now you need to…

Is it comically cheap if you don't consider inflation? Because while air travel has undoubtedly gotten less comfortable, in most (if not all?) cases it's also gotten cheaper. With every passing decade air travel because accessible to broader and broader swaths of the economic pyramid. Now it's at the point where the cost of the taxi to a London airport can cost more than the airfare of whatever budget airline flight…

Air travel definetely got cheaper. As as a software engineer (with a bit for search hacking) I can now afford flying across globe (26 hrs) in business (which used to be first) twice a year.
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