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Ravelry, a Popular Knitting Site, Bans Pro-Trump Content

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Re: Ravelry, a Popular Knitting Site, Bans Pro-Trump Content

#31

Post by mcphage »

s9w wrote: post #26
mcphage wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They turn racism from something useless into something they can use. This is what is truly 'deplorable'. No, I'm pretty sure it's putting kids into concentration camps that's deplorable. Nice try though.

Seeing the word concentration tramp unironically being used in a current world is obscene. Where did that even come from? That cropped fake photo on twitter?

> Seeing the word concentration tramp unironically being used in a current world is obscene.

No, what's obscene is what we're doing to children. THAT is obscene.

Re: Ravelry, a Popular Knitting Site, Bans Pro-Trump Content

#32

Post by s9w »

eesmith wrote: post #28
s9w wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seeing the word concentration tramp unironically being used in a current world is obscene. Where did that even come from? That cropped fake photo on twitter?

https://www.newsweek.com/concentration-camps-alexandria-ocas... > "Concentration camps are considered by experts as 'the mass detention of civilians without trial.' Even without photos, we know there is mass detention of civilians without trial. Do you deny that? What term do you want to use? From the same link: > We don't say 'prisons' because prisons are a part of the formal legal system," Lester Andrist, a sociolo…

AOC said "never again" in her concentration camp remarks, CLEARLY making the connection to WW2 concentration camps.

Re: Ravelry, a Popular Knitting Site, Bans Pro-Trump Content

#33

Post by whamlastxmas »

s9w wrote: post #19
eesmith wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Undisputed" is a needlessly strong statement, don't you think? I mean, do you agree that the Earth is not flat, and not younger than 20,000 years old? Yet there are many Flat-Earthers and Young Earth Creationists who dispute those facts. So, if I said "minimum surface distances between different cities on the Earth can be approximated using spherical trigonometry", would you then complain that I was stating that lik…

2. ?? There are men and women, nothing else 3. These people have an astronomic suicide risk. Not exactly fit for military 5. https://www.reddit.com/r/The_Donald/comments/5myu6x/let_me_c... 7. Criticism of a Jewish person is not anti-semitism. Criticism of Soros is very rational. This is one of the most insane threads I've ever seen on HN.

Agreed. Unfortunately HN isn't a viable place to have reasonable political discussion.

Re: Ravelry, a Popular Knitting Site, Bans Pro-Trump Content

#34

Post by eesmith »

0815test wrote: post #23
aantthony wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When they say "Support of the Trump administration is undeniably support for white supremacy" as if it were an undisputed fact, and without any argument at all, it really shows how they're incapable of considering an alternative worldview. To an ideologically enslaved mind it literally cannot be denied.

This. The radical progressive's worldview is that our society is itself a white supremacist society - this is taken as axiomatic and a matter of definition , not as something that could be meaningfully argued about, or even be said to depend on anything concrete about the real world! Thus, by definition, any support for existing social structures (including support for President Trump!) can be rightly defined as "sup…

I can support the Civil Rights Act of 1964 - an existing social structure - without being rightly defined as supporting white supremacy.

I can support woman's suffrage without being rightly defined as supporting white supremacy.

How do you distinguish between "taken as axiomatic" and "is the case"?

Eg, I can describe 1970s South Africa as being a white supremacist society, yes?

You certainly agree that at one point US laws were based on white supremacy, right? Eg, the Illinois Constitution of 1848, quoting https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Illinois_Constitution_of_1848 :

> The general assembly shall, at its first session under the amended constitution, pass such laws as will effectually prohibit free persons of color from immigrating to and settling in this state;and to effectually prevent the owners of slaves from bringing them into this state for the purpose of setting them free.

That sounds pretty white-supremacy, yes?

If so, when did the US stop being a white supremacist society, and how?

Re: Ravelry, a Popular Knitting Site, Bans Pro-Trump Content

#35

Post by gemjam »

eesmith wrote: post #29
gemjam wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Its not irrelevant, because the terms white supremacist and neo-nazi have merged. Meanwhile Netanyahu campaigns with Trump, names a town in the Golan after Trump... which violates the key characteristic of white supremacy: namely not liking Jews; ergo he is not a white supremacist

Nonsense. White supremacy is the broader term. It's meaningful to characterize the (early) American Federation of Labor policies as being rooted in white supremacy. It's not meaningful to characterize them as neo-Nazis. Several 19th century state constitutions prohibited black people from moving to them. This should be correctly understood as white supremacy. They did not prevent Jews from moving to them. Hence those…

We can both cherry-pick history all day long, but back in the real world, the Prime Minister of Israel does not campaign with a white supremacist

Re: Ravelry, a Popular Knitting Site, Bans Pro-Trump Content

#36

Post by whamlastxmas »

mcphage wrote: post #25
RickJWagner wrote: post #16

Shameful. It's fine to disagree with President Trump. It's fine to disagree with Democrats, too. Having an opinion is your right. But to slander and lie, and try to influence people in this way is just wrong. Let's be honest. President Trump has brought record low unemployment, rising wages, and justice reform to African Americans. His support among American Blacks has risen, not fallen. He is doing some good. Yet th…

> They turn racism from something useless into something they can use. This is what is truly 'deplorable'. No, I'm pretty sure it's putting kids into concentration camps that's deplorable. Nice try though.

You mean like Obama did for his entire 8 years?

Re: Ravelry, a Popular Knitting Site, Bans Pro-Trump Content

#37

Post by RandomInteger4 »

mcphage wrote: post #31
s9w wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seeing the word concentration tramp unironically being used in a current world is obscene. Where did that even come from? That cropped fake photo on twitter?

> Seeing the word concentration tramp unironically being used in a current world is obscene. No, what's obscene is what we're doing to children. THAT is obscene.

Forcing them to cross deserts while sick with no food or water?

Oh, wait, no, that's what their traffickers from Honduras and elsewhere are doing as they claim that those children belong to them when they reach the border so that they can receive higher priority treatment, whereupon they enter and recycle the kids back across the border.

Re: Ravelry, a Popular Knitting Site, Bans Pro-Trump Content

#38

Post by 0815test »

eesmith wrote: post #34
0815test wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This. The radical progressive's worldview is that our society is itself a white supremacist society - this is taken as axiomatic and a matter of definition , not as something that could be meaningfully argued about, or even be said to depend on anything concrete about the real world! Thus, by definition, any support for existing social structures (including support for President Trump!) can be rightly defined as "sup…

I can support the Civil Rights Act of 1964 - an existing social structure - without being rightly defined as supporting white supremacy. I can support woman's suffrage without being rightly defined as supporting white supremacy. How do you distinguish between "taken as axiomatic" and "is the case"? Eg, I can describe 1970s South Africa as being a white supremacist society, yes? You certainly agree that at one point U…

> ...without being rightly defined as supporting white supremacy.

I did say "can be", not "is always defined as such, in a logically-consistent way"! One point that should be quite obvious is that one can always say "that doesn't go far enough!" in a totally unfalsifiable way. (And yes, people have made such arguments, seemingly in all seriousness, even about such things as women's suffrage or civil-rights legislation!) It's a mistake to think that this sort of mindset is restricted by any kind of logic or rationality.

> How do you distinguish between "taken as axiomatic" and "is the case"? ... If so, when did the US stop being a white supremacist society, and how?

Again, the point is that the radical-progressive mindset is not interested in such questions. They are simply not seen as something that's inherently legitimate as a subject of inquiry. You are naïvely assuming that the appeal to notions such as "white supremacy" is intended to be meaningful - to say something, anything about the real world - when in fact it might as well be something that's said purely "for the lulz", for the sheer amusement of making one's political opponents uncomfortable. It's less about "debate" of any sort than it is about sheer intimidation and willful confusion.

Re: Ravelry, a Popular Knitting Site, Bans Pro-Trump Content

#39

Post by whamlastxmas »

eesmith wrote: post #28
s9w wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seeing the word concentration tramp unironically being used in a current world is obscene. Where did that even come from? That cropped fake photo on twitter?

https://www.newsweek.com/concentration-camps-alexandria-ocas... > "Concentration camps are considered by experts as 'the mass detention of civilians without trial.' Even without photos, we know there is mass detention of civilians without trial. Do you deny that? What term do you want to use? From the same link: > We don't say 'prisons' because prisons are a part of the formal legal system," Lester Andrist, a sociolo…

There's tons of Jewish people, including a Holocaust survivor and former victim of a real concentration camp, telling AOC to quit her bullshit.

The kids are in a detention facility. Donald Trump didn't personally decide "fuck Mexicans" and rip kids out of their loving homes. He's protecting children from the people in an adult detention facility who have actively broken the law and took their families with them in the process.

Calling Trump a Nazi and calling these places concentration camps is a massive slap in the face to the millions of people who actually died from the war.

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