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Libra, a Cyberpunk Nightmare in the Midst of Crypto Spring

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Re: Libra, a Cyberpunk Nightmare in the Midst of Crypto Spring

#71

Conspicuously missing from the entire libra story is how they are actually going to manage the peg. How will they handle the custodian counter-party risk? What I mean by that is: for libra to actually be a stablecoin, for every libra unit in circulation, FB and their merry band of friends will need to stash a frozen combo of {dollar, euro, yen} somewhere. That "somewhere" is actually not easy at all to design from a…

> Conspicuously missing from the entire libra story

All of this is answered in the Libra whitepaper.

> is how they are actually going to manage the peg. How will they handle the custodian counter-party risk?

"The assets in the Libra Reserve will be held by a geographically distributed network of custodians with investment-grade credit rating to provide both security and decentralization of the assets."

> be regularly audited by independent auditors

Pretty much any custodian with investment-grade credit ratings will be audited and heavily regulated.

> Worse, these custodians of what is already essentially virtual money are going to be sitting on a huge pile of currency and to guarantee the peg, won't be allowed to do anything with it.

The funds are not held in currency -- the funds are invested in "a collection of low-volatility assets, such as bank deposits and short-term government securities in currencies from stable and reputable central banks."

> be risk-free (and there is no such a thing) or the peg will drift.

Also answered: "as the value of the underlying assets moves, the value of one Libra in any local currency may fluctuate. However, the reserve assets are being chosen to minimize volatility, so holders of Libra can trust the currency’s ability to preserve value over time."

Re: Libra, a Cyberpunk Nightmare in the Midst of Crypto Spring

#72
post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1) Irreversibility. You have a payment system with that small companies can actually build gateways to true cryptos. Not to mention the “high risk” businesses locked out or priced out of fiat gateways 2) Cryptographic proofs of payment. With that you can do a lot of fun stuff, especially with smart contracts. Going back to #1 you can make the gateway trustless

strong irreversibility sounds nice for a financial business of for b2b, but from a common usage perspective it has no benefit whatsoever.

You can build reversibility on top of irreversibility but not vice versa.

Re: Libra, a Cyberpunk Nightmare in the Midst of Crypto Spring

#73
post #9

You know, strategically, when you’re about to get super regulated and the government is touting antitrust probes: maybe don’t start something that competes with the Dollar.

They are competing on a world wide stage larger than any one government.

Re: Libra, a Cyberpunk Nightmare in the Midst of Crypto Spring

#74

Libra isn't a cypherpunk wet dream, but it moves us in that direction and thats a good thing. This article is written from the perspective that crypto mass-adoption is right around the corner (i.e. just a few UX tweaks) and that Libra will displace the crypto-utopia that could-have-been. I couldn't disagree more. The lack of adoption is a combo of a 1) network "dead-zone", 2) reversal risk, and 3) regulatory friction…

In cypherpunk terms, what’s dreamy about a crypto currency with no anonymity, that shifts power from international democratic governments to private US corporations?

Because you thunk governements having power over currency is a good thing? At least with corporations you can choose to deal or not with them, that's the dream.

Re: Libra, a Cyberpunk Nightmare in the Midst of Crypto Spring

#75

I wonder: why does everybody say it's a "Facebook currency", a Facebook project, if there are +/- 30 corporations in the association? Does Facebook have more decision power than Visa, MasterCard or any other participating corporation? Or is Facebook simply the main vector Libra will be promoted with? Would Libra still be a project if Facebook was (hypothetically) shut down?

> why does everybody say it's a "Facebook currency", a Facebook project, if there are +/- 30 corporations in the association?

Because FB launched it, and currently appears to have the most control over the project. At the same time, people don't actually take the time to understand the governance model.

> Does Facebook have more decision power than Visa, MasterCard or any other participating corporation?

No. They get a seat in the governance organization, which they hope will be about 100 organizations at launch (so they get ~1% of the vote.)

> Or is Facebook simply the main vector Libra will be promoted with?

For now, looks like it.

> Would Libra still be a project if Facebook was (hypothetically) shut down?

Yes, it would. Again FB will have just 1% of the control at launch.

Re: Libra, a Cyberpunk Nightmare in the Midst of Crypto Spring

#76
Sure it'll be nice to make easy money off the interest on deposits. And it'll be nice to make money on the analytics that can be run on all the worlds' transactions. Great.

But the biggest pay off is that once consumers buy into Libra as a thing on its own, the policy can be changed to no longer link it to any basket of currencies, and it can then be issued without that annoying and expensive currency-buying-thing. Just pure profit.

What am I missing?

Re: Libra, a Cyberpunk Nightmare in the Midst of Crypto Spring

#77
post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In cypherpunk terms, what’s dreamy about a crypto currency with no anonymity, that shifts power from international democratic governments to private US corporations?

Because you thunk governements having power over currency is a good thing? At least with corporations you can choose to deal or not with them, that's the dream.

[deleted]

Re: Libra, a Cyberpunk Nightmare in the Midst of Crypto Spring

#78
post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In cypherpunk terms, what’s dreamy about a crypto currency with no anonymity, that shifts power from international democratic governments to private US corporations?

Because you thunk governements having power over currency is a good thing? At least with corporations you can choose to deal or not with them, that's the dream.

> At least with corporations you can choose to deal or not with them

That position beaks down when the corporations control the means of transaction.

It would be a different story if Libra was a bunch of companies making an arrangement to accept each other's individually-issued cryptocurrencies, but instead its a cabal issuing one scrip that they all control.

Re: Libra, a Cyberpunk Nightmare in the Midst of Crypto Spring

#79
post #27

Libra shows what crypto and in particular blockchain is really for: allowing global megacorporations to start their assault on the nation state. It's pretty critical we undo this, while the nation state still has its monopoly on the legitimate use of force.

Why do we need nation states?

What do you propose instead?

Re: Libra, a Cyberpunk Nightmare in the Midst of Crypto Spring

#80
post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In cypherpunk terms, what’s dreamy about a crypto currency with no anonymity, that shifts power from international democratic governments to private US corporations?

Because you thunk governements having power over currency is a good thing? At least with corporations you can choose to deal or not with them, that's the dream.

> Because you thunk governements having power over currency is a good thing?

I don’t have too strong an opinion, but certainly it’s a well-understood thing.

What specifically is bad about it? The ability for governments to seize money or interfere-with/surveil transactions looks like it will be preserved via Libra’s KYC/AML surveillance/protections.

I suppose for people with very large amounts of money, they might disagree with their government’s currency policy re: inflation/deflation. But for those people, a huge range of investment products exist to hedge.

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