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The V Programming Language

vlang.io

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Re: The V Programming Language

#91

Post by lifthrasiir »

amedvednikov wrote: post #56
lifthrasiir wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because language creators do know what is possible and what is hard. I think the Odin's creator has made some mistakes when presenting one's criticism [1] but even without knowing much PL knowledge AndyKelley is very clearly showing that it is shady. [1] https://github.com/vlang/v/issues/35 (For example, there are ways to implement generics or interfaces without AST, much harder but a possible endeavor.)

Yes, Andy Kelley being really reasonable: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20231484 Calling me a scammer because "V requires glfw and freetype". I have no words.

And also clang. If your initial release only has a code generation using clang, it is your hard dependency. Windows doesn't have a native compiler and it must have a compiler beforehand---so a bare compiler wouldn't work at all! (I know that the initial release lacked Windows. But I have no reason to believe that the Windows version will be different.)

Don't tell me that it is a pre-alpha and will be updated on 22 June, that reads like a sure way to instantly kill your reputation. Always make sure that what you have presented (not what you will present) and what you have said align to each other.

Re: The V Programming Language

#92

Post by amedvednikov »

gingerBill wrote: post #87
amedvednikov wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Classic.

Stop advertising your language as being more capable than it is. That is the only complaint. You are advertising under false pretenses and asking for money for early access to a product (through Patreon) which does match what is advertised.

First of all the language is released on June 22. It was released today for 7 hours. There's no more early access.

Second of all, you haven't listed any of these "false pretenses". Your AST and runtime points are laughable. So is the "dependency" on glfw and freetype.

Re: The V Programming Language

#93

Post by amedvednikov »

lifthrasiir wrote: post #85
gingerBill wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is not what I stated in the issue. For the kind of features that you wanted in your language, not just generics, requires a form of AST (abstract syntax tree), and if you language does not have an AST, which is technically possible, then you cannot have a lot of the features you have been advertising.

I should stress that that is also your misconception. For example, you can implement generics without an AST if you don't care about performance; codegen can either output a single binary mandatorily requiring a sort of vtable (therefore every parametric code will be indirected), or output a partial binary with holes where holes will be patched later (much faster but disallows optimization across hole boundaries). Yo…

No you don't understand :) It's IMPOSSIBLE without AST. The Odin creator says so. That's why I'm a liar.

V simply generates functions for every type they're used with.

Re: The V Programming Language

#94

Post by [deleted] »

lifthrasiir wrote: post #85
gingerBill wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is not what I stated in the issue. For the kind of features that you wanted in your language, not just generics, requires a form of AST (abstract syntax tree), and if you language does not have an AST, which is technically possible, then you cannot have a lot of the features you have been advertising.

I should stress that that is also your misconception. For example, you can implement generics without an AST if you don't care about performance; codegen can either output a single binary mandatorily requiring a sort of vtable (therefore every parametric code will be indirected), or output a partial binary with holes where holes will be patched later (much faster but disallows optimization across hole boundaries). Yo…

[deleted]

Re: The V Programming Language

#95

Post by ardaozkal »

lifthrasiir wrote: post #23
AndyKelley wrote: post #22

[flagged]

> He's collecting $927/month on Patreon by deceiving generous and hopeful programmers. Oh my. This is alarming. I have never thought that the author was already getting that much money out of this incomplete piece of software.

And that's not his only patreon.

https://www.patreon.com/vlang is the one in question

but he also has https://www.patreon.com/voltapp

Nice scam.

Re: The V Programming Language

#96

Post by amedvednikov »

lifthrasiir wrote: post #89
amedvednikov wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes I delayed the release by 2 days to clean up readme. "Lol"

This is the first time I've ever heard of why the source release was delayed. I have also managed to see the related issue [1], which was posted too late. You should have said at the first time. [2] You have instantly earned much reputation by releasing Volt at the first time; that reputation is much easier to lose as well. People easily gets disappointed, no matter what you have achieved (or think that you can achie…

I'm sorry, proprietary languages? What are you referring to?

Re: The V Programming Language

#97

Post by amedvednikov »

lifthrasiir wrote: post #89
amedvednikov wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes I delayed the release by 2 days to clean up readme. "Lol"

This is the first time I've ever heard of why the source release was delayed. I have also managed to see the related issue [1], which was posted too late. You should have said at the first time. [2] You have instantly earned much reputation by releasing Volt at the first time; that reputation is much easier to lose as well. People easily gets disappointed, no matter what you have achieved (or think that you can achie…

> This is the first time I've ever heard of why the source release was delayed.

My comment was sarcasm by the way.

And sorry for the delay, I was sleeping.

Re: The V Programming Language

#99

Post by ardaozkal »

letters90 wrote: post #8

I'm curious but too lazy to look it up myself. SO I'll just ask. How far does the 'linux' specification go. Say I want to run a V program on AIX what kind of libraries will I need? What about the 'windows' specification. Do the redistributables support windows 2000/7/Vista/8/8.1/10 We have a lot of different systems on our clients, mac as well. It would be nice to read concrete requirements for running to really see…

Nothing related to linux or windows is out yet.

macos was out, but got pulled.

Re: The V Programming Language

#100

Post by amedvednikov »

lifthrasiir wrote: post #90
amedvednikov wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wow, calling me a fraud and a scam artist based on these "facts"?.. The compiler has ZERO dependencies, as stated on the website. You can build it with `clang v.c`. Do you really think the compiler needs glfw or freetype to function? It's for the graphics library to build things like the tetris.v example. As for clang, It was made very clear that V compiles to C in addition to emitting native code, and that it's much…

> Hot code reloading will be available on June 22. What the heck, so you have claimed that it's just a readme or source cleanup but that was actually a huge missing feature. You said that you have high standards [1], but you don't seem to have high standards on what you say. [1] https://blog.vlang.io/post/13/Why-isn't-everything-already-o...

You need to detect sarcasm. Did you think I was serious when I said I was delaying by 2 days to clean up readme?
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