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Facebook moderators break NDAs to expose working conditions

theverge.com

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Re: Facebook moderators break NDAs to expose working conditions

#481

Post by averros »

Oh, and the simple thought of refraining from censorship and giving users the tools to self-sanitize their feeds never actually crossed the Facebook mgmt's minds.

Because, apparently, Facebook is not only about stalking the users and manipulating them into buying more stuff they don't need, but also about manipulating them into believing into the "right" stories and voting for the "right" people.

All of which makes censorship - both algorithmic and human-based - a must.

Another take-out from the article (for Facebook users): your perception of reality is being shaped by the kind of people who can't (or can't be bothered to) find a better job paying $15/hr.

Re: Facebook moderators break NDAs to expose working conditions

#482

Post by H8crilA »

Apocryphon wrote: post #464
H8crilA wrote: post #442

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's no alternative. The only other option (for Facebook and content moderation) is to shut down the shop & return equity to investors, or do nothing and wait for the platform to blow up. And even then someone will make Facebook v2. Just the economic incentive to cut moderators loose and use algorithms would be enough to do so if it were possible. After all you can buy a decent amount of compute power for 30+k/yr,…

That’s all or nothing thinking. The immediate alternative is to improve working conditions for moderators. Or impose more stringent bans and punishments on those who post that sort of material. Those are just for starters.

Look I wish everyone had a nice life, I really do, but markets set salaries while governments sometimes intervene (e.g. by setting a minimum wage).

Don't know about the banning situation, that'd require insider Facebook knowledge. I'm sure they ban some people.

Re: Facebook moderators break NDAs to expose working conditions

#483

Post by greghatch »

vageli wrote: post #471
shujito wrote: post #463

Earlier quoted context omitted.

...which it's unlikely to happen because of the NDA's they have to sign. If there's something wrong with this reasoning, please elaborate.

> ...which it's unlikely to happen because of the NDA's they have to sign. > If there's something wrong with this reasoning, please elaborate. I would be utterly surprised if an NDA could be used to prevent an employee from exercising their right to organize (in the US at least). Just because you sign something does not make it legally enforceable.

Yeah - but how would they know what is legally enforceable or not?

It's really complicated and I don't think it's reasonable to assume people have access to a clear answer on enforceability and certainly not an answer they could rely upon enough to risk their job over,

Re: Facebook moderators break NDAs to expose working conditions

#484

Post by [deleted] »

neuro wrote: post #388

Social Media Content Moderation Team Lead Cognizant Technology Solutions Tampa, Florida • This is an exempt position, requiring day, evening, weekend, and holiday shifts, as this delivery center is operational 24/7 and 365 days a year. Cognizant is seeking a team of strong Team Leads to manage a team of social media content moderators for a global social media organization. The Team Lead will be responsible not only…

[deleted]

Re: Facebook moderators break NDAs to expose working conditions

#487

Post by nonwifehaver3 »

cldellow wrote: post #12

This was a valuable article to read. Facebook is enormously valuable. They made something like $15B in net income in the last four quarters. Content moderators are a necessary condition for that profit. If kiddie porn, gore and animal cruelty flooded the network, it would cease to be a destination visited by people that advertisers will pay to reach. And yet, there are two sets of entry-level knowledge workers at Fac…

How can kiddie porn, gore and animal cruelty "flood the network" for people using Facebook? Don't you normally just see things from your friends, ads, and groups that you are a part of? If they post that, either call the cops, block them on Facebook, don't hang out with them irl, or leave the group as appropriate. Problem solved? I haven't used Facebook in 5+ years so maybe this is no longer accurate.

Re: Facebook moderators break NDAs to expose working conditions

#488

Post by hashkb »

cldellow wrote: post #12

This was a valuable article to read. Facebook is enormously valuable. They made something like $15B in net income in the last four quarters. Content moderators are a necessary condition for that profit. If kiddie porn, gore and animal cruelty flooded the network, it would cease to be a destination visited by people that advertisers will pay to reach. And yet, there are two sets of entry-level knowledge workers at Fac…

> Facebook is enormously valuable. They made something like $15B in net income in the last four quarters.

Their profit is not proof they are valuable, because they are willfully abdicating responsibility for the damage they cause, and, further, involving themselves in government debates over their own regulation.

Advertising businesses are inherently suspect, and when one is addictive and potentially enabling election fraud etc, we need to be extra careful in declaring its value.

Anyone participating in the debate should have to disclose if they are a daily user or if their company advertises on any social network. (I'm clean)

Edit: my opinion of course is that FB, Insta, etc (any advertising product with push notifications and/or infinite scroll) ought to be illegal. In 50 or 100 years we'll all recognize that social networks are like internet cigarettes.

Re: Facebook moderators break NDAs to expose working conditions

#489

Post by 8bitsrule »

ralusek wrote: post #170
cldellow wrote: post #12

This was a valuable article to read. Facebook is enormously valuable. They made something like $15B in net income in the last four quarters. Content moderators are a necessary condition for that profit. If kiddie porn, gore and animal cruelty flooded the network, it would cease to be a destination visited by people that advertisers will pay to reach. And yet, there are two sets of entry-level knowledge workers at Fac…

I don't understand how this isn't a problem perfectly solved by the market. If it's a shit job that isn't worth the pay, people won't do it. If it's an okay job that isn't really worth the pay, they will have high turnover. High turnover has a cost, maybe it's worth it to them. If the turnover is so high or the job is so undesirable, maybe they'll axe the role. If the role is so important to the business that it can'…

>> If it's a shit job that isn't worth the pay, people won't do it.

Tell that to the people who pick your fruits and veggies.

Re: Facebook moderators break NDAs to expose working conditions

#490

Post by consumer451 »

ihm wrote: post #474
Miner49er wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Facebook won't do anything to help these moderaters unless the cost of the negative PR exceeds the cost of doing something. Engineers at FB could help achieve this by causing agitation, for sure. Maybe the best solution is for the moderaters to unionize.

The union would be stronger if it included the engineers too, who have more leverage.

In my idealized universe FB engineers would have to rotate through moderation for 1 week per year. In my impossibly idealized universe the C suite would do the same.
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