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The student loan crisis is really an underemployment catastrophe

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Re: The student loan crisis is really an underemployment catastrophe

#361
post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where are you buying rental houses for $42k?

Inner city. There are always cheap rentals if you look around. I'm landlocked with no beaches. This helps costs tremendously.

What's the ROI on such rentals (cost of property vs. amount of rent generated per month)?

Re: The student loan crisis is really an underemployment catastrophe

#362

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Both of these are ludicrous. The salaries for my school are public, they are for all public schools (that I've looked at at least). I can tell you from the data from my school the administrative costs have gone up substantially. Both from number of administrators increasing significantly. The average administrative staff wage is over 250k (I know that's not a lot in tech salaries, but that is HUGE where I am. Cost of…

Congratulations, you have disproven statistical evidence by providing an anecdote.

This really doesn't fit the definition of anecdote. It is a counter example. You can see other comments for direct reasoning why the data in the article is wrong. There's things like the statement about unemployment not considering that unemployment doesn't count those who left the workforce, which is also at highs. Or to things like that you can't compare elementary and high schools to college.

I know your comment sounds witty, but it is lacking real value and really adds to the problem at hand. Surprisingly things are extremely nuanced and we try to just point to "simple solutions" we generally make the problem worse. Frankly because we are not considering the system and distracting ourselves from solving the problem (calling it done when we've only just started).

Re: The student loan crisis is really an underemployment catastrophe

#363
post #324

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It’s self-evident that if those college graduates who are underemployed had chosen different courses, then the problem would look quite different. Not only is this not self-evident, it defies common sense and economics. If more people take professional degrees then the supply of those degrees increases and salaries decrease (and we're back where we started). That is, if there are enough professional jobs to go arou…

Your anecdata doesn’t add much to the conversation, and you seem to be relying on a particularly extreme interpretation of what I said. It’s a fact that there are many skilled professions where we have labor shortages. If more people (I never said all people) had chosen to study in those fields, then they likely would not be facing underemployment. Unless you want to disputed the existence of skilled labor shortages,…

There is no doubt some salary gains to be made by a small percentage of people choosing to go into professional programs (as I said above), but it's really besides the point. The main issue is that there will still be a large number of students who can't benefit from this strategy.

Re: The student loan crisis is really an underemployment catastrophe

#364
post #277

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think US population increased 14% in the last 15 years (even the world is barely 16%).

But people out of poverty and into middle class around the world has.

I don't think that happened in the US, and I don't think they immigrated so it's not really an effect on US colleges.

Re: The student loan crisis is really an underemployment catastrophe

#365

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think someone that is 17-18 should be referred to as a Child. I do think the Universities should do more to disclose the likelyhood of working in a given profession based on their degree path... however, realistically, the individual bears a lot of responsibility. Aside: based on some actions/headlines that consistently pop up in news articles (most recently Oberlin)... maybe we should start treating them lik…

Someone at 17-18 can be mature... but the US school system and the general culture around how teenagers are handled doesn't do much if anything to actually encourage that. It's entirely possible for people going into college today to have had zero opportunity to pick their own classes, manage their own bills, or have any real control of even the tiniest career up to that point, which is exactly the worst context to c…

Then, perhaps the schools should start treating them like children and putting a foot down when they start running roughshod... And by this I mean High Schools and Universities. Again, the world is not fair, it isn't meant to be. And children should learn this.

Beyond all of that, PARENTS should be raising their children. They seem to be too concerned about protecting their kids, instead of letting them know in deep specifics how bills/finances in the home work. There's no reason a 10yo can't sit with you when you pay bills, or look at a spreadsheet that outlines things.

It doesn't even take THAT much... I have most of my paycheck going into an account that bills get paid out of... most are set to autopay, except the largest ones (house/car payments). Every two weeks, when I get paid, I sit down and pay those bills due. The rest of my paycheck goes into an account that is for day to day expenses, and that's all I get for it.

In the end, it's not JUST the schools that are responsible for raising children, and the (US) government doesn't do a very good job of most things. Raise your children people.

Re: The student loan crisis is really an underemployment catastrophe

#366
post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have 50 decades of life and work in tech. You tell me ?

Look, Methusela. I doubt you were working in software in the 1500s.

Please don't post shallow attacks on other people because of obviously trivial misstatements. That adds noise, not signal.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: The student loan crisis is really an underemployment catastrophe

#367
post #363

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your anecdata doesn’t add much to the conversation, and you seem to be relying on a particularly extreme interpretation of what I said. It’s a fact that there are many skilled professions where we have labor shortages. If more people (I never said all people) had chosen to study in those fields, then they likely would not be facing underemployment. Unless you want to disputed the existence of skilled labor shortages,…

There is no doubt some salary gains to be made by a small percentage of people choosing to go into professional programs (as I said above), but it's really besides the point. The main issue is that there will still be a large number of students who can't benefit from this strategy.

For that to be true, there has to be too few skilled employment opportunities available in the entire economy to provide employment for college graduates. A position neither you nor the author of the article have provided any evidence to support.

Re: The student loan crisis is really an underemployment catastrophe

#368

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1) if it does turn out to be true that we need "fewer workers", that's great, we just move to a 30-hour work week (or 20, or whatever). We once had 6-day work weeks, or sometimes even 7, and it was productivity gains that allowed us to move to 5. We can move again. 2) But, I'm not sure it's even true. We mostly got to where we are by having all the manufacturing done in 3rd world countries for pennies. It's not that…

I like the idea or shortening the work day, unfortunately the commonman jobs are the ones being automated out of existence. There will only be a smaller percentage of people who can actually do the majority of the jobs. Education may help some with this but only to a certain degree. The days of assembly line work are nearing an end. I don't know what will happen to the population who are unable to work, perhaps more…

See point #3, above. The "commonman jobs" did not, in fact, get automated out of existence, they mostly got moved to countries with LESS automation than the advanced economies, which is the opposite of what one would predict if automation were the issue.

Re: The student loan crisis is really an underemployment catastrophe

#369
post #363

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no doubt some salary gains to be made by a small percentage of people choosing to go into professional programs (as I said above), but it's really besides the point. The main issue is that there will still be a large number of students who can't benefit from this strategy.

For that to be true, there has to be too few skilled employment opportunities available in the entire economy to provide employment for college graduates. A position neither you nor the author of the article have provided any evidence to support.

I guess I assumed that it's self-evident ;)

Re: The student loan crisis is really an underemployment catastrophe

#370

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If this were 10yr ago I'd agree. The 80s gave us computers. The 90s gave us good simulation software and the engineers used that to build us reliable cars. The early 2000s gave us plastic interior and exterior trim that didn't rattle and fall apart in short order. Since then we've tacked more gears onto automatic transmissions, hybrids have become more mainstream, sedans and wagons have been replaced with small SUVs…

Gas mileage is better, backup cams are standard (and required), the average age of a vehicle on the road is 11 years (up from 8 years in the 90s), so they are more reliable and last longer, better airbags (side curtains are standard nowadays), better anti-corrosion technology, adaptive cruise control, lane assist, auto parallel parking, partial autopilot, bluetooth standard, etc.

Would you say that the average age of a vehicle is longer due to cars being pricy and people fixing them up or because they are far more reliable? I could see it going both ways.
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