About 2M People Rally in Hong Kong Weekend Protests • Hacker News Board

Re: About 2M People Rally in Hong Kong Weekend Protests

#101

Post by DiogenesKynikos » Sun, Jun 16, 2019, 6:14 PM UTC

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #90

DiogenesKynikos wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not obvious. Hong Kong has its own political dynamic, and is deeply divided between pro- and anti-Beijing camps.

The chief executive is basically a pawn of Beijing, where democracy is limited and many delegates who elect the CEO are appointed by pro Beijing groups. If HK got rid of their appointed delegates, the anti-Beijing group would have a clear majority.

It's not clear who would have the majority if functional constituencies were eliminated. The pro-Beijing camp got a higher proportion of the popular vote than the anti-Beijing camp in the last Legislative Council election.

Yes, democracy is limited in Hong Kong. The city has never been ruled democratically. The issue now is that Beijing will not take the risk of allowing separatists to take power.

As for the Chief Executive's actions, it's not entirely clear to what extent she's responding to popular pressure, business groups in Hong Kong that want stability, or the central government.

Re: About 2M People Rally in Hong Kong Weekend Protests

#102

Post by riffraff » Sun, Jun 16, 2019, 6:15 PM UTC

ksec wrote: post #88

guilhas wrote: post #82

Some notes * French yellow vests are ignored week after week. This is all over the place. * HK already has extradiction with the USA. * USA debacle demanding a journalist extradition to prosecute. * Protesters posters are in english. * Mainstream narrative, small HK will be successful independent. UK brexit will be terrible because it will be a insignificant country.

Let's be fair, Yellow Vest has been going on for months. And France has a democratic system in place. Use it! >* Protesters posters are in english. There are just far too many Chinese Poster you don't get to see.

Also, yellow vests protests at the top were less than 200k people, in a country of tens of millions.

The only reason they made the news is because protests were violent.

Re: About 2M People Rally in Hong Kong Weekend Protests

#103

Post by pimmen » Sun, Jun 16, 2019, 6:15 PM UTC

I live on the other side of the world, but this still strikes a deep chord with me.

I'm Swedish, born and raised in Gothenburg. After the Umbrella protests in 2014 five people connected to the Causeway Bay Books store in Hong Kong disappeared. One of them is a naturalized Swedish citizen, his daughter was raised in my home town. He is now imprisoned and can't communicate with his daughter, or with the Swedish authorities. Angela Gui, his daughter, is continuing on the struggle for his release to the extent she can, being only 21 when her father disappeared.

All these arguments about "leave China be" or "this isn't the West's problem" just don't make any sense to me. This is a small world, whether we like it or not, and letting authoritarian stuff like this extradition treaty to a dictatorship slide is condoning it and before you know it your citizenship, constitutional rights and passport which you thought would keep you safe doesn't work anymore and you get snatched from a street for something you've said. Your family can only cry themselves to sleep over it from the feeling of powerlessness.

We don't have to go into hypotheticals about what will happen if China gets more power to persecute people of Hong Kong. In Sweden, we already know what they've done with the limited power they hold now.

Re: About 2M People Rally in Hong Kong Weekend Protests

#104

Post by JumpCrisscross » Sun, Jun 16, 2019, 6:18 PM UTC

loyukfai wrote: post #80

potatofarmer45 wrote: post #73

So my HK team had the week off to protest. Luckily I didn't get any calls at 2am to bail anyone out of jail. This result- where the government backed down, was not expected by anyone. Ever since the Beijing-picked government stared down the Umbrella Protests in 2014, it's been a death by a thousand cuts to Hong Kong's autonomy. After talking to a friend who works for one of the pro-Beijing parties, it turns out the b…

The damage is done. It will take quite some time for the opinions of the Taiwanese people to change again, if ever.

We’re used to Beijing thinking for the long term. When they rotated leaders, this was largely true. With Xi as leader for life, however, the short-term decision making and incompetent bureaucracies that characterises dictatorships are beginning to emerge.

Hong Kong shouldn’t have been a problem. Most Hong Kongers, until recently, identified as Chinese moreso than Hong Konger. The transition in 2047 would have been uneventful.

Now, Hong Kong pissed off. Taiwan has seen the writing on the wall. China’s multi-decade integration strategy must be rethought because Xi didn’t think he could survive Hong Kongers criticising his leadership (including its corruption).

Re: About 2M People Rally in Hong Kong Weekend Protests

#105

Post by hellofunk » Sun, Jun 16, 2019, 6:19 PM UTC

CydeWeys wrote: post #24

swjz wrote: post #18

They've made it. The Chief Executive apologized and the government has suspended the fugitive law amendment. That's really a RARE concession in these years because the Chinese government typically doesn't compromise at all under pressure.

"Suspended" just means that it would be passed as soon as the protest pressure lets up. That's not good enough. They haven't made it yet.

According to the news, it’s unlikely that any progress on the bill will be made until next year, based on this protest. It is not just suspended, they also canceled further open discussions about it.

Re: About 2M People Rally in Hong Kong Weekend Protests

#106

Post by aaron_m04 » Sun, Jun 16, 2019, 6:19 PM UTC

manigandham wrote: post #38

swjz wrote: post #18

They've made it. The Chief Executive apologized and the government has suspended the fugitive law amendment. That's really a RARE concession in these years because the Chinese government typically doesn't compromise at all under pressure.

This is nothing but a temporary delay. It will still be passed soon enough. Remember Hong Kong is on a 50 year countdown anyway so there’s always an inevitable end coming.

Who knows what things will be like then? China could be a democracy or something else.

Re: About 2M People Rally in Hong Kong Weekend Protests

#107

Post by hellofunk » Sun, Jun 16, 2019, 6:19 PM UTC

manigandham wrote: post #38

swjz wrote: post #18

They've made it. The Chief Executive apologized and the government has suspended the fugitive law amendment. That's really a RARE concession in these years because the Chinese government typically doesn't compromise at all under pressure.

This is nothing but a temporary delay. It will still be passed soon enough. Remember Hong Kong is on a 50 year countdown anyway so there’s always an inevitable end coming.

According to the news, it’s unlikely that any progress on the bill will be made until next year, based on this protest. It is not just suspended, they also canceled further open discussions about it.

Re: About 2M People Rally in Hong Kong Weekend Protests

#108

Post by rolltiide » Sun, Jun 16, 2019, 6:20 PM UTC

manigandham wrote: post #38

swjz wrote: post #18

They've made it. The Chief Executive apologized and the government has suspended the fugitive law amendment. That's really a RARE concession in these years because the Chinese government typically doesn't compromise at all under pressure.

This is nothing but a temporary delay. It will still be passed soon enough. Remember Hong Kong is on a 50 year countdown anyway so there’s always an inevitable end coming.

> Remember Hong Kong is on a 50 year countdown anyway so there’s always an inevitable end coming.

I used to think that and it is logical

But the basic law does not have an expiration date, only HK’s geographical status does

So it theoretically can still exist under a separate legal system , the point is that there are possibilities

Re: About 2M People Rally in Hong Kong Weekend Protests

#109

Post by Lucadg » Sun, Jun 16, 2019, 6:22 PM UTC

ksec wrote: post #34

I wish they could use the Official Figure as 2M and 1. The 1 was tribute to the one died in protest of the bill [0]. R.I.P And I don't think the photos aren't what 2M people in the City really looks like. Here are few better ones. And thank you everyone who supported us, even if you are not in HK, it is still much appreciated. [0] https://time.com/5607742/hong-kong-protester-dies-anti-extra... [1] https://ibb.co/WtLM…

Thank you. This is my new wallpaper now.

Re: About 2M People Rally in Hong Kong Weekend Protests

#110

Post by [deleted] » Sun, Jun 16, 2019, 6:23 PM UTC

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #90

DiogenesKynikos wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not obvious. Hong Kong has its own political dynamic, and is deeply divided between pro- and anti-Beijing camps.

The chief executive is basically a pawn of Beijing, where democracy is limited and many delegates who elect the CEO are appointed by pro Beijing groups. If HK got rid of their appointed delegates, the anti-Beijing group would have a clear majority.

[deleted]