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Magnesium and major depression (2011)

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

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Re: Magnesium and major depression (2011)

#121

Post by kerkeslager »

There are two huge confounding issues here which make it impossible for me to conclude that Mg has an effect of depression based on the studies I've seen:

1. Magnesium may treat anxiety rather than depression. This is analogous to various SSRIs which arguably treat anxiety better than depression[1]. Anxiety and depression are highly comorbid, and both doctors and patients may be bad at differentiating between the symptoms, leading to "I feel better"-type reporting. This might mean that Mg supplementation is a good thing for depressed people because it treats their anxiety, not because it treats their depression. This alternative hypothesis is particularly compelling because magnesium deficiency has a variety of well-understood effects on muscle tension[2] which mimic physical symptoms of anxiety.

2. Magnesium is frequently supplemented concurrently with vitamin D, vitamin K, calcium, and zinc. All of these are known to be active in humans, and vitamin D in particular has been correlated with depression and seasonal affective disorder.

[1] https://slatestarcodex.com/2018/11/07/ssris-an-update/ (see under the bolded "fourth" comment--SSC has a bunch of posts on this topic).

[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnesium_deficiency#Diagnosis

Re: Magnesium and major depression (2011)

#122

Post by petilon »

aik wrote: post #78

For anyone here that takes magnesium for sleep, why do you think it works for you? It works wonders for my sleep but I’ve never met anyone that shares that view.

The cells in our body depend on two essential minerals for normal function: Calcium and magnesium. Cells go into ON state when calcium goes in, and OFF state when calcium goes out. Calcium doesn't go out on its own: magnesium has to go in and displace the calcium. When you are low on magnesium, cells can't go into OFF state. When that happens your muscles become stiff and you need massages, and your brain can't turn off and you can't sleep.

Re: Magnesium and major depression (2011)

#123

Post by ThrowawayP »

mboto wrote: post #11

I have found that taking Magnesium is like turning a switch on in my head and I'm suddenly happy again. I don't get upset or angry in the same way, I'm more patient and my thoughts are not obsessive. Magnesium is best taken with calcium and vitamin D as both are used in the uptake of magnesium. I have found that processed foods, alcohol, caffeine and sugar all make me worse, but magnesium gives me the will power to c…

As another data point, magnesium supplementation doesn't do squat for my depression. Reputable brand, used the glycinate form, proper dosing, etc. No perceptible effect.

Re: Magnesium and major depression (2011)

#124

Post by fifnir »

icxa wrote: post #83
fifnir wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When the free market is in charge the results aren't much better, why not have another go at the government approach and learn from our mistakes?

The free market is responsible for the biggest large-scale change in sustainable farming and organic produce, meats, and dairy we have seen so far, why not double down on that and accelerate the progress made? If you would have told me 10 years ago that organic produce, meats, and dairy would be commonplace in a Walmart grocery store, I would have laughed, but here we are. Conversely it is only through large governme…

You know that "organic" is pretty much a bullshit marketing term right?

> large government subsidies of corn and soy

That's not exactly what leftists fight for when they fight for government money. Gut those, gut those hard I don't care.

Is the government behind the sugar lobby too? https://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/13/well/eat/how-the-sugar-in...

Is the government now bringing all the unhealthy things from the West to developing countries? https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2017/09/16/health/brazil...

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/4092629 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8161771 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1363897/

Or is it the free market looking for a new source of dollar at the expense of people's health ?

Re: Magnesium and major depression (2011)

#125

Post by ysleepy »

idiot900 wrote: post #5

This smells like a crackpot. The first author’s affiliation is his own “research institute”: https://m.george-eby-research.com/ and they claim a simple, somehow overlooked solution to a difficult problem, citing flimsy and ancient studies.

Also the first entry in the reference section is "ABC Homeopathy (2010) Magnesia Muriatica [..]" - without any mention in the text itself that it is used as some quip.

Re: Magnesium and major depression (2011)

#126

Post by geggam »

sapilla wrote: post #70

I found CBD to provide temporary relief - I think my depression was inflammation related. The world is still dark and compressed but also comfortable, like the dark corners fill with algae and the ground with grass. What ended up working was improving my oral posture and articulation using ortothropics and self-developed speech exercises (the important part is having designed the exercises yourself). Suddenly it's va…

The entire endocannabanoid system in humans is interesting. If you think about it less than 100 years ago hemp and CBD oil was in our diet. Almost like we evolved with a system for it.

Re: Magnesium and major depression (2011)

#128

Post by ekianjo »

ThrowawayP wrote: post #123
mboto wrote: post #11

I have found that taking Magnesium is like turning a switch on in my head and I'm suddenly happy again. I don't get upset or angry in the same way, I'm more patient and my thoughts are not obsessive. Magnesium is best taken with calcium and vitamin D as both are used in the uptake of magnesium. I have found that processed foods, alcohol, caffeine and sugar all make me worse, but magnesium gives me the will power to c…

As another data point, magnesium supplementation doesn't do squat for my depression. Reputable brand, used the glycinate form, proper dosing, etc. No perceptible effect.

> for my depression

Depression is an array of conditions caused by multiple different root causes, so it's possible that Magnesium works only on some of them only and not on others.

Re: Magnesium and major depression (2011)

#129

Post by tarsinge »

kevstev wrote: post #85

I started taking magnesium supplements about 9 months ago, not for any depression issues, but more for muscle issues. I had a weird leg muscle injury a few years ago that I never really got a proper diagnosis for that happened when doing some light hiking. In doing my own research on that, a condition similar to my symptoms came up, and one of the causes was a magnesium deficiency. I had a few other minor ailments co…

Anecdotical but for years I had various anxiety and mild depression problems (edit: and various muscle “twitches”). As it was not severe I was always recommended Magnesium. Never had any improvement. Then 2 years ago I started taking vitamin D (thanks to HN discussions) and nearly all my symptoms disappeared (also changed job, started meditation, so the datapoint is not clear but magnesium alone didn't do much).

Also I recommend you get tested for Magnesium as contrary to popular belief (at least here in France) deficiency is not common (contrary to vitamin D).

Re: Magnesium and major depression (2011)

#130

Post by azeotropic »

opportune wrote: post #102

The first author has a publication called "zinc lozenges as a cure for the common cold" here: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19906491 and given that the author has his own "research institute" I'm highly skeptical of this guy's ability to do science. Seems like some kind of crackpot I mean seriously look at this website: https://m.george-eby-research.com/app/welcome/5310242/36/

He may be a crackpot, and this book is not a well-written summary of the literature, but the idea of magnesium levels influencing depression is not a crackpot idea.

Magnesium is a cofactor for the enzymes that convert tryptophan into serotonin. Most of the body's serotonin is synthesized in the gut, where it helps control the muscles that move the bowels. (I assume this is why magnesium salts act as laxatives).

Magnesium is also implicated in other serotonin related disorders (e.g. Migraine).

Even broken clocks are right twice a day.

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