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Apple is making corporate ‘BYOD’ programs less invasive to user privacy

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Re: Apple is making corporate ‘BYOD’ programs less invasive to user privacy

#71

Post by Wowfunhappy »

pjmlp wrote: post #13
mysterypie wrote: post #11

An obvious solution is to carry two devices: one for work, on which the company can install whatever corporate spyware they want, and one for personal use. There's no way I'm letting my employer administer or install unknown programs on my personal laptop and cell even with this enrollment option. This has nothing to do with trusting or distrusting Apple. It's due to avoiding complexity: having to think about a zilli…

Naturally. I never got the BYOD thing. My employer should provide the required tools, if not, then the work is done within the constraints of what is available.

My employer offered to buy me a laptop. It was a perfectly good laptop in most respects, but I turned it down because I didn’t like the keyboard.

Re: Apple is making corporate ‘BYOD’ programs less invasive to user privacy

#72

Post by GordonS »

Kalium wrote: post #10

> Apple also noted that one of the big reasons users fear corporate BYOD programs is because they think the IT admin will erase their entire device when the enrollment ends — including their personal apps and data. Yes. This is a true thing that users fear. It tends to happen because they're using phones that don't allow any more constrained option. It's nice to see iOS catching up with Android in this.

I've had InTune and also some VMWare device management installed on my device in the past, and during installation you do get a warning that your admins will be able to delete everything on your device.

It kind of makes sense for them to do that if your device is stolen, but I still just don't like handing over control of my device like that.

They typically also enforce other annoying policies, such as not allowing rooted devices, not allowing swipe patterns and requiring a PIN/password. The VMWare one even required that all browsing went through their shitty browser app (and presumably they got all my history).

Again, some of this makes sense from an enterprise point of view, but as a user it's annoying and feels invasive.

Re: Apple is making corporate ‘BYOD’ programs less invasive to user privacy

#73

Post by ginko »

diminoten wrote: post #20
mysterypie wrote: post #11

An obvious solution is to carry two devices: one for work, on which the company can install whatever corporate spyware they want, and one for personal use. There's no way I'm letting my employer administer or install unknown programs on my personal laptop and cell even with this enrollment option. This has nothing to do with trusting or distrusting Apple. It's due to avoiding complexity: having to think about a zilli…

It is a burden however, and one that isn't necessary if your company has a sane BYOD policy that protects them while not being too invasive. The reality is, convenience wins again here. I, for one, don't give a shit what control my company has over my phone. Not only has nothing ever happened as a result of me using a BYOD policy, the overall rate in the industry seems acceptably low too. I only have 24 hours in my d…

The burden of having two devices seems lower than the burden of having to separate work from private life on a single device.

Re: Apple is making corporate ‘BYOD’ programs less invasive to user privacy

#74

Post by MartyMartyn »

jakobegger wrote: post #24

This is nice and all, but I really wish that Apple would allow some real multi-account functionality. Especially for iPads, but also for iPhones. When I hand my phone to my kids to play a game, I don't want them to have access to my email / text messages / contacts etc. It's ridiculous that a 1000€ device is restricted to single user mode. It's even worse for iPads -- they are perfect devices for sharing in the famil…

The function is there, just not enabled for end users. Enterprise and Education can use multi user switching on iPads, plus a whole lot more.

Re: Apple is making corporate ‘BYOD’ programs less invasive to user privacy

#75

Post by drchickensalad »

sdoering wrote: post #68
reubenmorais wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please see the link I added. You should check your employment contract to see the exact terms of the copyright assignment clause you signed, but it's definitely very common to have to assign any inventions you make that are "related to your employers area of work", regardless of what hardware you use or if you do it in the office or at home.

Well who signs contracts like these? I mean really? And why? I really cannot understand anybody giving away that much of their live for an employer/the next paycheck. Yeah - if I am really, really in a tight spot financially - for as long as it takes to crawl out of such a mess - ok. But regularly? Long term? Help me to understand. And I also do not understand how a company could find this morally acceptable to have…

99% of people sign them. Almost everyone will barely read it. The rest assume that it won't affect them.

Re: Apple is making corporate ‘BYOD’ programs less invasive to user privacy

#76

Post by MartyMartyn »

jimmcslim wrote: post #23

I wonder if this lays the groundwork for multiuser support in iPadOS at least?

Groundwork has been there for years, called 'Shared iPad' - but its for Education use only... Via an enterprise or education MDM solution you can restrict and configure the iPad in many, many different ways; again, its not for the consumer.

Re: Apple is making corporate ‘BYOD’ programs less invasive to user privacy

#77

Post by tomp »

sdoering wrote: post #62
closeparen wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which regulation requires spyware on endpoints, and where in the text does it say that?

In Germany for example most companies in the automotive space require all contractors to conform to the [TiSAX]( https://enx.com/tisax/tisax-en.html ) regulations. These state, that there needs to be proof of several data security aspects on all devices of all people working in a facility for one of these companies/clients as a contractor: - Anti Virus software up to date - Firewall active - Harddisk encrypted - Abil…

iOS allows remote wipe functionallity in the standard mail client. Hopefully this doesn't enable any spying... Personally, I'm happy for my employer to have this functionality (trusting them not to abuse it)... My personal data is backed to the cloud anyways, so if I lose my phone I want it to be wiped.

Re: Apple is making corporate ‘BYOD’ programs less invasive to user privacy

#78

Post by Wowfunhappy »

epanchin wrote: post #37
jakobegger wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"App Pinning" sounds like it's similar to "Guided Access" which has been available on the iPhone forever. That is not what I want. My kids are old enough to navigate the phone on their own, and they use multiple apps. I just want Face ID to recognize that it's my kid, and not show them notifications for my work related stuff, and just let them play Minecraft and Monument Valley or whatever they want.

But Apple wants you to buy your kids their own devices.

True, but it's also a pretty obnoxious form of nickle and diming for a company selling $1,000+ iPhones, and well worth complaining about.

It’s also yet another way that locked-down devices allow manufacturers to advance their interests at the expense of consumers. There’s a Jailbreak tweak that enables multiple profiles...

Re: Apple is making corporate ‘BYOD’ programs less invasive to user privacy

#79

Post by human20190310 »

userbinator wrote: post #57
reubenmorais wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't that the case regardless of what laptop you're using? As far as I can tell you should assume any side projects are Copyright (c) your employer unless you talk to legal first and make an arrangement (for each project). See for example: https://www.joelonsoftware.com/2016/12/09/developers-side-pr...

No, what you do on your own time (not company time) with your own resources can't be owned by the company, because otherwise everything you do would be owned by the company, which is absurd; suppose I went to a friend or relative and helped him/her out by writing a simple script, does that belong to the company now? How about posts you make on HN outside of work (if you do it at work, that's... questionable)? The pos…

> [S]uppose I went to a friend or relative and helped him/her out by writing a simple script, does that belong to the company now?

That's a good question, and only answerable by checking what you've signed and what the laws in your jurisdiction are.

Some of the agreements, even in the US, are pretty aggressive about grabbing as much IP from an employee as possible.

Re: Apple is making corporate ‘BYOD’ programs less invasive to user privacy

#80

Post by flurdy »

adrianN wrote: post #32
fuzzy2 wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem with employer-provided tools is that they sometimes barely meet the minimum requirements. Sure it gets the job done, but it’s no fun. I’d rather buy and manage my own device, which is then powerful enough for my needs.

If your employer doesn't provide the tools you need it's time to talk to them about how much time you lose due to crappy hardware and how many hours of your salary would pay for a better machine.

Different budgets, different departments, different people.

In smaller or more nimble companies you or rather your line manager can influence hardware budget as an offset of your salary v productivity. Also in some larger organisations where departments/teams are more autonomous and have more slack your manager may be able to influence that.

But in many large organisations, those who decides what standardised underpowered hardware you shall have may never have even met your line manager and they can not influence that policy.

I have once worked with a client that handed out a completely hamstrung laptops with barely any memory and slow disks to all contractors. Project builds would take 30 minutes or more, and I'd watch paint dry by reading slashdot(a long time ago), jousting on chairs in the corridor etc... Plus more time lost as you don't realise instantly when the build has finished and the time to reload all the context back into your own brain's memory...

The difference in cost between a top spec machine and the one they handed out was less than the invoice cost of the lost productivity in a day or two. I was there for two years... Granted after a while I did get better and better machines but never good.

Though I no longer really work for clients that do that, and my last few contracts have been BYOD which is fine by me. As long as they provide a quality external monitor and the sit-stand desk then I'll bring my own macbook.

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