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Amazon to shut down its Amazon Restaurants business in the U.S.

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Re: Amazon to shut down its Amazon Restaurants business in the U.S.

#21
post #16

Amazon had a restaurant business? The funny thing is, Amazon probably could do a good delivery restaurant business. There are already many "delivery only restaurants"[1] Uber Eats encourages others to start them. But Amazon, unlike Uber, is capable of building physical infrastructure. The future of this is "food fulfillment centers", large warehouse spaces which house various specialty kitchens. Common functions, suc…

Hm kind of reminds me of Ikea's food racket. Actually I'm sitting here trying to think of why that wouldn't work but I honestly can't. Cool idea!

Re: Amazon to shut down its Amazon Restaurants business in the U.S.

#22
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's already lots of healthy competition in moving companies. Imagine if the movers wanted a percentage of your home price instead of few hundred for the day's work. The problem with realtors is that they've got a lock on the bureaucratic side, and the existing realty sites (Zillow, Trulia, etc...) are aligned with them. There are upstarts in some cities, but the existing realtors in those places collude to keep t…

How does the collusion work? Just curious since it seems like such an inefficient market (our realtor was a good friend of ours, he /did/ have good local market knowledge and things to say, but no way did he have to do more than 4 or 5 hours of work total for us...)

As an example, buyer's agents will not show, or disparage, homes where the agent's get less than their approx 3%. For instance, Trelora in Denver offers a discount to the seller, but they'll offer full rate to the buyer's agent because they know they'll get more traffic that way. You can kind of read that between the lines in their FAQ:

https://corporate.trelora.com/faq

Even if the buyer finds one of these homes on their own, all the buyer's agent needs to say is something scary like, "I've seen deals like this fall apart, and I wouldn't risk tying up your money if you're not dealing with a responsible realtor".

Then they'll say something like, "besides, the seller pays the closing costs!" ... which is a huge lie if you consider that the buyer is the only person bringing any money to closing.

Re: Amazon to shut down its Amazon Restaurants business in the U.S.

#24
post #15

I'm not surprised. Amazon's entire MO is a relentless focus on the customer. They do that by methodically optimizing and controlling every aspect of the supply chain right up to the moment the product is handed off to the customer. And they get better at it every day. Restaurant delivery breaks that model. There is too much variability. Too much can go wrong outside their control, and they don't have enough leverage…

Mac donald's seems to do exactly that.

Re: Amazon to shut down its Amazon Restaurants business in the U.S.

#25
post #16

Amazon had a restaurant business? The funny thing is, Amazon probably could do a good delivery restaurant business. There are already many "delivery only restaurants"[1] Uber Eats encourages others to start them. But Amazon, unlike Uber, is capable of building physical infrastructure. The future of this is "food fulfillment centers", large warehouse spaces which house various specialty kitchens. Common functions, suc…

Just as there are already “enough” physical cars, there is also already enough physical restaurant infrastructure, so today it’s more a question of efficient utilization. What Uber Eats is doing in this space is really smart: Keeping track of local food search keywords, and reaching out to local restaurants saying “Hey, if you provided such-and-such food items at such-and-such time of day in your area, we think you’d do really well. You can sell these items on Uber Eats under a different brand if they don’t fit in your existing cuisine niche.”

Longer-term you’re probably right that centralization could be more efficient in some cases, but looking too far into the future often makes less economic sense today. See: Webvan.

Re: Amazon to shut down its Amazon Restaurants business in the U.S.

#26
Disclaimer: Amazon investor

I’m glad. I didn’t see this going anywhere. I’ve tried the service several times when I was living in Seattle. Pretty much every option had terrible ratings and everything I tried was generally a bad experience. Delivery was always on time, but paying $15-25+ per person for a soggy, wet meal just wasn’t worth it. We ordered a pizza one time arrived completely cold with soggy crust.

Re: Amazon to shut down its Amazon Restaurants business in the U.S.

#27
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's already lots of healthy competition in moving companies. Imagine if the movers wanted a percentage of your home price instead of few hundred for the day's work. The problem with realtors is that they've got a lock on the bureaucratic side, and the existing realty sites (Zillow, Trulia, etc...) are aligned with them. There are upstarts in some cities, but the existing realtors in those places collude to keep t…

How does the collusion work? Just curious since it seems like such an inefficient market (our realtor was a good friend of ours, he /did/ have good local market knowledge and things to say, but no way did he have to do more than 4 or 5 hours of work total for us...)

I thought about this a lot during our home buying process. Our agent, too, wasn't asked to do much... because we found the house we wanted online, and had our financing, so the agent didn't have to show us any houses or help us along in any way. She just submitted our offer and that was that.

I have heard that realtors, like for instance car dealers, simply have a vested interest in middleman-ing the inventory by way of commission and there are powerful lobbies that protect that interest. I've heard that there is cartel-like control over the MLS listing service, which requires you to be a member of the Realtors Association for access, and is a shared venture between all the major real estate companies -- which, if you aren't a part of, basically means you can't even know what house is for sale. I don't know if any of that's true.

In this day in age, it's hard for me to fully trust a process like buying property that is just so opaque. Purely for conversation purposes, an anecdote of mine: we bought a house and we were willing to pay a certain amount over, no more, because we had a hard budget. So we told our agent, we want this house for list price. The agent says, we can do that, but "the seller is expecting multiple offers and they are reviewing them tomorrow". Okay, fine, whatever. So we put in our offer, with an escalation clause going up another $15k to our theoretical max. Lo and behold, we have two offers on the table that beat ours. "But they really liked your letter, so is there any way you could make your offer better? Borrow money from your family? Take an employer loan from your 401k?" So I say no, absolutely not, I won't be doing that. We'll just wait til next year when we have more money and do this again. Thanks.

So a week later, we get a phone call. Oops! Guess what? The top offer bailed unexpectedly, and the 2nd best offer wants time to reconsider. "If you resubmit your offer tonight, I'm sure the seller will accept". Okay, fine, resubmit it. Thirty minutes later, the offer was accepted and we closed in about 20 days from then. It was a crazy ride! And we are definitely happy with the house we got for the price we paid. But at the same time, I'm left to wonder... how do I know those other offers existed? How do I know they weren't just trying to get more money out of us? I suppose I could ask for proof, but even those types of documents have been faked before. I trusted our people and the process seemed above board, but it's one of those things that is so convoluted and human that I felt weird about it then, and I still do to some extent. Perhaps I'm just cynical. It really doesn't keep me up at night, though. Like I said, I'm happy with the place.

But the reality was clear: in that industry, it seems so clear that collusion COULD easily exist... and if that's the reality, I'm sure it does exist in at least some instances.

Re: Amazon to shut down its Amazon Restaurants business in the U.S.

#28
post #25
post #16

Amazon had a restaurant business? The funny thing is, Amazon probably could do a good delivery restaurant business. There are already many "delivery only restaurants"[1] Uber Eats encourages others to start them. But Amazon, unlike Uber, is capable of building physical infrastructure. The future of this is "food fulfillment centers", large warehouse spaces which house various specialty kitchens. Common functions, suc…

Just as there are already “enough” physical cars, there is also already enough physical restaurant infrastructure, so today it’s more a question of efficient utilization. What Uber Eats is doing in this space is really smart: Keeping track of local food search keywords, and reaching out to local restaurants saying “Hey, if you provided such-and-such food items at such-and-such time of day in your area, we think you’d…

But a "restaurant on wheels" is a idea that will be truly profitable, at least in theory! Its true that restaurants abound in localities today but mobility of people (and their eating preferences) from one location to another has also increased. Restaurants which are profitable today may not be tomorrow. A restaurant on wheels can easily adapt to changing demands by constantly moving on from low demand areas to high demand ones. Maybe, Amazon can even build an AI or something to guide it for most efficiency.

Re: Amazon to shut down its Amazon Restaurants business in the U.S.

#29
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Redfin is already in that market and it doesn't seem to be doing very well. I'm actually fairly surprised how slow redfin is able to grow and expand their market. Their website felt second to none in terms of usability.

Redfin looks like they're trying to be a "discount agent". Here is a quote from their front page: > We're full-service, local agents who get to know you over coffee and on home tours, and we use online tools to make you smarter and faster. This isn't what I had in mind at all, and I'm not surprised they have trouble getting traction with that approach. If they save you 1.5% on your half, but the other agent still get…

> There is no reason home sale paperwork should cost thousands of dollars to process. Someone like Amazon could eliminate agents altogether.

It’s a mistake to think that the real estate commission is primarily for paperwork or executing transactions that would have happened anyway.

I brought my house to our agent and pushed the sale through. That’s probably a rarity when I think about all the time friends of mine have spent with agents “house hunting”. That time costs money and to a great extent, the fat commissions are paying for a lot of “no commissions”.

People seeking to disrupt the “fill out the final transactional paperwork” part of real estate need to figure out how to disrupt the whole value chain, not just the part that looks outrageously overpriced.

Re: Amazon to shut down its Amazon Restaurants business in the U.S.

#30
post #4

I wonder if Amazon would ever dive into the home real estate market. With modern day search, realtors provide very little value above doing the paper work, and that seems very automatable. There's just no reason to pay 6% of every house sale to middle men, but that's the way it currently works. A large company like Amazon or Google could make a ton of money at a much lower rate. I think this makes a lot more sense th…

It's expensive to have boots on the ground in every zip code. RedFin hires their own agents full time. OpenListings and Zillow refer online buyers to their affiliated agents who cut them a deal on commission in exchange for leads. You can always list a place with photos and all on Zillow or CraigsList and mention that seller will not pay an agent's commission. End of the day there's a "For Sale by Owner" sign for those driving or walking by.

But considering that in the US it's the seller who pays both agents, there are no immediate savings for potential buyers, and some, being new to the home-buying process in general or new to that zip code, would prefer some hand-holding and chit-chatting provided by their agent at no cost to them.

Among some not so obvious valuable tidbits that the buyer's agent can provide:

* general feel about the neighborhood, whether it's on the rise or in decline

* previous scandals and issues, like contaminated water, city attempting to pass an additional levy or tax, house being on the airport path, etc.

* potential future improvements, like a light rail station planned nearby

* referrals to various local professionals, like inspectors, surveyors, painters, or movers

* any other new developments in town or neighborhoods that the buyer might not have considered, especially when shopping remotely

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