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Zero Rupee Note

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Re: Zero Rupee Note

#211

Post by naravara »

1024core wrote: post #209
naravara wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You’ve diagnosed the problem well, but I don’t understand how that leads to “smaller government” being a solution. In many regards are relate to civic responsibility, India probably needs bigger government. They need it both to enforce the small laws (litter, traffic rules, safety regulations) as well as building the sustained infrastructure to make life more convenient (mass transit to deal with traffic, public hous…

I think both of you are right. We need a smaller existing type of government, and we need a bigger new type of government, which is more answerable to the people. Consider, for example, the police force. They are not customer (inasmuch as you can call the voter/taxpayer a customer) oriented force; they are a subjugation force. They carry sticks around, which they wield with gay abandon. Many of the forms of power in…

Local control is a double edged sword. It may make them more sensitive to local issues if they’re part of the community, but it can also lead to arbitrary enforcement or non-enforcement from one area to another or between one group or another.

The smaller the political unit, the more likely it is to be dominated by a clique of people. This can lead to corruption, but even in a non-corrupt setting it can lead to racist, casteist, or other kinds of discriminatory decisions about enforcement or resource allocation.

Re: Zero Rupee Note

#212

Post by NikolaeVarius »

naravara wrote: post #203
kamaal wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>>Some of these things are not exceptions but the rule. You could be downvoted, the real reason is so many Indians don't even think this is anything wrong. Globalization has presented an opportunity for Indians like me to travel abroad and see how well the systems work outside. For a lot of Indians, something like this is invisible. Often the exposure is to infrastructure seen through Hollywood movies or these days,…

Clean parks and friendly transit staff!? San Francisco must have changed since I left. :-p

I think these can be extremely relative

Re: Zero Rupee Note

#213

Post by [deleted] »

skykooler wrote: post #206
hirundo wrote: post #86

Could negative currency be useful? For instance a fungible, negotiable debt instrument, registered on a blockchain so it can't be unilaterally destroyed. Put contractual language on it to the effect that "Registering acceptance of this note obligates you to pay $X to the U.S. treasury by date Y." Bob buys an apple from Alice but doesn't have the cash, so instead accepts/registers a -$1 note from Alice, who now has le…

What's to stop someone throwing negative value currency in the trash and thereby gaining money?

[deleted]

Re: Zero Rupee Note

#214

Post by rtkwe »

skykooler wrote: post #206
hirundo wrote: post #86

Could negative currency be useful? For instance a fungible, negotiable debt instrument, registered on a blockchain so it can't be unilaterally destroyed. Put contractual language on it to the effect that "Registering acceptance of this note obligates you to pay $X to the U.S. treasury by date Y." Bob buys an apple from Alice but doesn't have the cash, so instead accepts/registers a -$1 note from Alice, who now has le…

What's to stop someone throwing negative value currency in the trash and thereby gaining money?

In OP's proposal it's all blockchain (jazz hands) so there's no disposing of it.

Re: Zero Rupee Note

#215

Post by Shish2k »

superqwert wrote: post #192
Semaphor wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I had a similar experience. I wanted to cancel my old credit card but couldn't find a way to do it online. As there were no fees I just ignored it. Well, it turned out that my VPN still had it as the payment method and so I got a bill to please pay my negative balance (they require at least 10% to be paid off after a month). Of course, I paid. But it turns out that I need to contact them to unlock the card after I ha…

I've tried to cancel a credit card and told I needed to withdraw all money first (I had +£5). I withdrew it, and asked them to cancel it again. They started processing, but by the time they had got anywhere, I'd acquired interest (1p) and they refused to cancel the card.

I had the same thing, after leaving the country - I had to fly home to take 1p out from the bank in person. "Don't spend it all at once!", the bank teller told me :P

Re: Zero Rupee Note

#216

Post by naruvimama »

naravara wrote: post #204
naruvimama wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agree with you entirely. When the British left India, there was officially a transfer of power to the congress party. The first prime minister was appointed by the party. The constitution, the police, the bureaucracy and the court system was inherited by the people. Unlike the developed world or China or Vietnam, India did not go through a bloody revolution. What that meant is that systems that were explicitly meant…

You’ve diagnosed the problem well, but I don’t understand how that leads to “smaller government” being a solution. In many regards are relate to civic responsibility, India probably needs bigger government. They need it both to enforce the small laws (litter, traffic rules, safety regulations) as well as building the sustained infrastructure to make life more convenient (mass transit to deal with traffic, public hous…

When I say small government - I only meant that the government should lower regulations and simplify laws. In the case of India, I am even in favour of the government stepping in to help fledgling industries, either because the local industry is so far behind or because foreign companies are deliberatly unwilling to be inclusive.

India does not have the ability to enforce - Lacks the resources to police and the diversity prevents uniformity.

Add to that draconian colonial/socialist era laws.

It is hard to enforce anything if you neither have the capacity nor need.

As an old civilisation India has an enormous capacity to self regulate. Compared to say the EU, India is way more diverse yet a single country and not by force.

A sane change would be to have bare-bone laws and swift justice on - property, business, greater personal freedom in education.

Complicated laws only favour the rich, powerful and definitely the corrupt. If the honest thrive, it would be increasingly expensive to be dishonest.

Re: Zero Rupee Note

#217

Post by firethief »

oasisbob wrote: post #143
gowld wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Zero is not null!

Arguably it could be nullified if the payment isn't legal due to being for zero value. Under UCC §3-104, a check is only a negotiable instrument if it's an unconditional order. UCC §3-103 defines an order as "a written instruction to pay money signed by the person giving the instruction." So, to answer the original question - I don't think a zero-amount check is legally a check because it's not a written instruction…

Hm. Is $0 not an amount of money?

Re: Zero Rupee Note

#218

Post by rizwank »

barry-cotter wrote: post #193
kamaal wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You need to put human resources development as the number one priority. As of now these are not even political issues in India. Nobody thinks these are important things to do. India started off well during its Independence, the first education minister( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abul_Kalam_Azad ) and the first prime minister( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jawaharlal_Nehru ). The idea was to build a highly trained…

Education has remarkably little to do with economic growth. Richer countries are more educated but changes in education do not predict changes in productivity. Education appears to be a superior good that people just purchase more of when they’re richer. Ghana is more educated now than France was in 1960 going by average years of education and it’s poorer. China’s years of explosive economic growth after Deng opened…

Do you have a resource to recommend that suggests reasons and provides data for this seemingly paradoxical observation?

Re: Zero Rupee Note

#219

Post by thtthings »

swamy_g wrote: post #89
thtthings wrote: post #46

I don't think people actually use the note though. I don't see anyone having guts to give that note to policemen or government officials in India. Everyone in India just like the US is scared of the Police and know not to mess with them.

People in US are scared of the police? I am from India and have been in US for a while now and have never been scared of the cops (unlike my time in India).

What is while? I lived in the US for a decade and please say Sir to the cop when he stops you and don't mess with them. Even a small incident can send you to the hospital

Re: Zero Rupee Note

#220

Post by Semaphor »

yitchelle wrote: post #188
namdnay wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Credit scores are an American construct :)

The Germans have their own version - Schufa [0]. :-( Most of other countries also have versions too. [0] - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schufa

While we have Schufa, you should not (and I did not) get an entry for 0€ debt. Schufa is far simpler than the US credit score.
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