Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Trump's Next Trade War Target: Chinese Students at Elite Schools

bloomberg.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

181–190 of 279 posts

Re: Trump's Next Trade War Target: Chinese Students at Elite Schools

#181

Post by PavlovsCat »

nneonneo wrote: post #155
briandear wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Was American science declining in the 1960s when almost no Chinese students were in American universities? Could there also be extremely smart people in Africa that might now find a place in American universities? Are there Americans that might now find a place in American Universities? I am not saying anything about visa policies, but suggesting that limiting Chinese students will hurt American science is a pretty n…

> there is no doubt that such approvals require allegiance to the CCP and and some willingness to help the CCP when asked. No, they really don’t. Where’s your source for this? You make it sound like we’re just admitting 350,000 spies into the States each year. However, it is true that if you make these folks feel thoroughly unwelcome, they will want to just go home and help out - and that’s exactly what you’ll do by…

If hurt feelings are going to make someone fight for a totalitarian regime, that itself would be plenty reason to be suspicious. Of course, assuming that's even true -- it's not like you provided a source or anything.

Re: Trump's Next Trade War Target: Chinese Students at Elite Schools

#182

Post by Muha_ »

(with a terrible russian accent) USA can be the opened center of the free world or it can be the closed and most powerful contry in the world. If USA uses its position as the opened center of free world to become closed contry that rules the world, we all will have a hard time.

Re: Trump's Next Trade War Target: Chinese Students at Elite Schools

#183

Post by dmos62 »

flukus wrote: post #124
Gatsky wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In Australia, all Chinese students were allowed to stay if they so wished after Tiananmen, the Prime Minister at the time made it happen. I think that was a proud moment for Australia. Times have changed, immigration is now a particularly obscene political tool, as is climate change.

And now the Australian University industry is nothing more than a scam that will print degrees for the highest bidders.

Talking of scams, someone I know does Architecture studies in Europe with some Chinese people. There's a couple who speak very little English, too little to be able to properly participate in group projects. Which is surprising at first, because there's a selection process there, which should filter that out. Apparently, in China, there's a thriving industry for fabricating portfolios and ghost writing motivation letters, and it's a common way of climbing the diploma ladder. I'm not sure how those people manage to not fail their exams though, because from the stories I heard they can understand very little and express very little.

Re: Trump's Next Trade War Target: Chinese Students at Elite Schools

#184

Post by emiliobumachar »

ekianjo wrote: post #174
henrikschroder wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US has a massive advantage in science (and business) in that many of the best and brightest from across the world want to come to the US, despite the hurdles and issues of getting student visas or work visas. This means that as a country you don't have to pay for the primary and secondary schooling of all these people, but you get to reap the rewards of them working in your country and contributing to your scient…

primary and secondary education costs virtually nothing compared to college so thats a pretty weak point to make. You could make the exact reverse point, that universities in the US have built their expertise over decades if not centuries and Foreign students are largely benefiting more from them than whatever they could get in their home countries.

It's a win-win thing for the U.S. and the students. (arguably a loss for the country of origin who sees their best and brightest fly away.) No one here is denying the impact of restrictions on students, we are pointing out it is also bad for the US.

Re: Trump's Next Trade War Target: Chinese Students at Elite Schools

#185

Post by rbg246 »

ashelmire wrote: post #178
tntn wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

60-80% of graduate students in STEM fields in the U.S. are international students. It seems like having 60-80% fewer graduates would accelerate the decline of American science.

Don’t most of them return to their home countries? Seems like freeing up those spots for American students that will stay would be a boon for American science.

That would seem to indicate that Americans who want to do STEM courses cannot currently do them? That doesn't sound right to me.

Re: Trump's Next Trade War Target: Chinese Students at Elite Schools

#186

Post by zwaps »

ulfw wrote: post #98
potatofarmer45 wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The question, is these bright minds never spent 10 years at MIT or Harvard, and instead spent it at Peking University, would be they be of the same caliber?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tsinghua_University Tsinghua in Beijing is one of the world's foremost universities. A ton of Chinese leaders and also two Nobel laureates come from there.

Not that it isn't a good university, I mean I hear decent things, but two Nobel laureates is really not that much for a top university. Many local European universities have more.

Re: Trump's Next Trade War Target: Chinese Students at Elite Schools

#187

Post by orhmeh09 »

C1sc0cat wrote: post #144
henrikschroder wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US has a massive advantage in science (and business) in that many of the best and brightest from across the world want to come to the US, despite the hurdles and issues of getting student visas or work visas. This means that as a country you don't have to pay for the primary and secondary schooling of all these people, but you get to reap the rewards of them working in your country and contributing to your scient…

If its like the UK International students are a source of income as they pay more and subsidise the locals.

How did universities ever manage to operate whilst charging much lower/no tuition back when there was not a group like this?

Re: Trump's Next Trade War Target: Chinese Students at Elite Schools

#188

Post by Juliate »

cltsang wrote: post #177
Tsubasachan wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Its fascinating how America is slowly turning into a country that simply doesn't want foreigners. Sadly I like New York so I have to diligently go through the mountain of paperwork. How many people from the EU overstay or cause problems for the police?!

How did you get that impression? From what the article says America is only getting more conscious about foreigners from China, not foreigners in general. They are quite different. This is hardly a surprising move considering the recent realization that the Chinese government has been pushing propaganda against American values like freedom, democracy, and basic human rights, on American soil. One notable example is c…

> not foreigners in general.

By requesting their social network identity, right. That's being conscious.

> propaganda against American values like freedom, democracy, and basic human rights, on American soil.

Well... someone skipped reading the news for the past 3 years. The best propaganda against these values comes from your very current president and administration.

Re: Trump's Next Trade War Target: Chinese Students at Elite Schools

#189

Post by henrikschroder »

Juliate wrote: post #157
henrikschroder wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US has a massive advantage in science (and business) in that many of the best and brightest from across the world want to come to the US, despite the hurdles and issues of getting student visas or work visas. This means that as a country you don't have to pay for the primary and secondary schooling of all these people, but you get to reap the rewards of them working in your country and contributing to your scient…

> The US has a massive advantage [...] in that many of the best and brightest from across the world want to come to the US And it's really, really actively fighting against it: electing Trump (and the consequences with it) is not the least they did in that perspective.

I don't think it's a conscious choice, I think that since the US has been a magnet for talent for so long, a lot of politicians, and a lot of people, have normalized it and think it's the natural order of things. They think that talent will keep coming, no matter what policies they implement, and that is simply not true.

Re: Trump's Next Trade War Target: Chinese Students at Elite Schools

#190

Post by nl »

onetimemanytime wrote: post #166
inflatableDodo wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Brits overstay and work in the US without the correct paperwork all the time. They don't seem to get noticed by the police for some reason.

China is causing problems for USA. Right or wrong, USA thinks that they are essentially educating their future battle enemy.

"Researchers" aren't exactly your typical students though. They contribute a huge amount to the IP developed within a country.

PhD students do a lot a the grunt work that more famous people get most of the credit for.

Post reply on HN