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India heatwave temperatures pass 50 Celsius

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Re: India heatwave temperatures pass 50 Celsius

#161

Post by TheCoelacanth »

ajross wrote: post #150
TheCoelacanth wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Offices and shopping malls are upper-middle class things in India. They would not come close to holding the entire population. There would be millions of people dying if temperatures got that high.

I'd want to see cites for that, honestly. Obviously India's commerce centers can't come close to handling a billion shoppers , but there's enough floor space in the urban core of Bangalore to house the at-risk population for a 72 hour heat wave. The point is emergency management here. And I'd bet anything that somewhere there's a workable plan drawn up for exactly this kind of occurrence.

India's total retail space is 2 sq ft/person[1]. That's not enough space for someone to sleep in, even assuming that 100% of the retail space there is air conditioned (it's not) and assuming that the AC systems can keep up with that much body heat in temperatures that high (they can't).

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Retailing_in_India#The_Indian_...

Re: India heatwave temperatures pass 50 Celsius

#162

Post by vram22 »

albertzeyer wrote: post #22
factorialboy wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes

If this is normal, then you imply that the article linked by inflatableDodo is wrong? Btw, I was kind of impressed, when visiting India and speaking to a few locals, that they don't see climate change to be a real thing, or at least to be such a big problem, and much overrated. The claim was basically that it was always very warm, and it is just normal that way, and they don't expect it to become much warmer. I'm not…

Why impressed by that, though?

Re: India heatwave temperatures pass 50 Celsius

#163

Post by phonypc »

jobigoud wrote: post #124
Isinlor wrote: post #19

These temperatures in high humidity can be deadly even to healthy and fit humans as our bodies are left without a way to cool down. Currently, they have humidity around 10-20% so it affects the most vulnerable, but global warming may lead to making parts of the world literally deadly to every human being... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wet-bulb_temperature The wet-bulb temperature (WBT) is the temperature read by a…

> fatal even to fit and healthy people, unclothed in the shade next to a fan; This is scary, what's a good way to survive for someone that doesn't have access to a bunker or AC? Immersing oneself in water in a bathtub?

I credit drinking copious amounts of ice water and frequent urination for helping me avoid hyperthermia for 10+ hours working in a kitchen where the air temperature read 52C + radiative heat from various equipment and high perceived humidity.

Granted I don't know the wet-bulb temp actually exceeded 35C

Re: India heatwave temperatures pass 50 Celsius

#164

Post by wongarsu »

leereeves wrote: post #154
myself248 wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The water is only cooler because it's evaporating, meaning the wet-bulb temperature also describes the water's own limit. 35°C is slightly cooler than body temperature, so it would work just a little bit as a heatsink, but another degree or two and even that becomes ineffective.

The water is cooler because the specific heat of water is very high, meaning it takes more heat energy to increase the temperature of water. So a large body of water stays cool for a long time, and then stabilizes around the daily average temperature, not the high.

> and then stabilizes around the daily average temperature, not the high.

However the acceptable temperature range in water is also much smaller because under water we exchange heat quickly and don't have a way to cool below the temperature of the water. Water above ~38°C would be dangerous to stay submersed in. Not a problem for huge bodies of water, but important to keep in mind on the small scale.

Re: India heatwave temperatures pass 50 Celsius

#165

Post by lotsofpulp »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #117
lotsofpulp wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is how all organisms’ population dynamics work. They expand until they meet their boundary conditions.

The defining charteristic of humanity is that we refuse to accept natural population dynamics and don't let ourselves be governed by them.

Humans have figured out some neat tricks to create hospitable boundary conditions where there were non, e.g. moving water, heat, and themselves around, but so have other organisms. But by definition, they are all subject to “natural population dynamics”, such as the sun going supernova, an asteroid hitting the earth, earth’s temperature rising a few degrees.

Also, I would bet long term survival success (very long term) under various environmental changes to organisms such as water bears over humans.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tardigrade

Unless we figure out cheap space travel and water production in the next few hundred years.

Re: India heatwave temperatures pass 50 Celsius

#166

Post by imtringued »

lotsofpulp wrote: post #40
dependsontheq wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would you write the same thing about Houston or Paris? If not it’s just racist.

This is how all organisms’ population dynamics work. They expand until they meet their boundary conditions.

In this case it's the opposite. We are sawing off the branch we are sitting on. It's not that we are expanding, we are shrinking the boundary conditions!

Re: India heatwave temperatures pass 50 Celsius

#167

Post by jjuhl »

inflatableDodo wrote: post #98
tinus_hn wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you think that is the answer, call it bigoted instead of playing the race card.

I generally do use the word bigot rather than racist. I know very few people who are only racist and not bigoted in other ways, so it tends to be more accurate. It also gives much less wiggle room and appears to cut into people's ego far more. As another observation, I have yet to meet anyone who uses the phrase 'playing the race card' , that has a considered opinion on that subject, or indeed many others. It is indi…

Well, thank you for putting people in boxes.

One can have a considered opinion and still think that playing the "race card" is despicable.

Try not to be so single-minded.

Re: India heatwave temperatures pass 50 Celsius

#168

Post by [deleted] »

vbezhenar wrote: post #158
jjuhl wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Affording that would likely equate several years of income to the average poor Indian. If even obtainable in a lifetime.

Air conditioner is like few hundred dollars. Are homes in India that cheap? Even cheapest homes in my countries will cost thousands of dollars. If someone can buy it, he can buy air conditioner.

[deleted]

Re: India heatwave temperatures pass 50 Celsius

#169

Post by jjuhl »

vbezhenar wrote: post #158
jjuhl wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Affording that would likely equate several years of income to the average poor Indian. If even obtainable in a lifetime.

Air conditioner is like few hundred dollars. Are homes in India that cheap? Even cheapest homes in my countries will cost thousands of dollars. If someone can buy it, he can buy air conditioner.

You underestimate the depth of poverty for some people. When you are living under a trash-heap as your home, a hundred dollars is a fortune fit for a king.

Re: India heatwave temperatures pass 50 Celsius

#170

Post by kache_ »

inflatableDodo wrote: post #107
kabwj wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s caused a divide because the number of current economic refugees is relatively small. Thus many people thought it was possible to have them stay in the first world. Hence the divide in public opinion. But I believe that if the estimates are right, the number of climate refugees will be so high that people will more or less agree that it’s better to close the border in that situation.

>the number of current economic refugees is relatively small Interesting way to describe people fleeing war.

Economic refugees don't have it good either. Starving and dying from disease isn't easy.
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