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Intel Announces 8 Core I9-9900KS: Every Core at 5Ghz, All the Time

anandtech.com

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Re: Intel Announces 8 Core I9-9900KS: Every Core at 5Ghz, All the Time

#221

Post by Merad »

skavi wrote: post #134
twblalock wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most of the people who write these articles for review sites do not really understand CPUs in depth. They know how to run benchmark suites and talk about new features mentioned in Intel's marketing material. Most of these people are writers, not engineers. If they were experts they could make a lot more money working at tech companies instead of working for review sites. In fact, I would bet that most professional so…

AnandTech is different. They cover μarch, and their writers clearly understand what they're talking about.

Anandtech was sold (or maybe Anand left, I don’t recall exactly) about 5-6 years ago. The depth of their technical writing isn’t what it used to be.

Re: Intel Announces 8 Core I9-9900KS: Every Core at 5Ghz, All the Time

#222

Post by nl »

ksec wrote: post #39

I used to be Pro Anandtech and consider them one of the best Sources online for Hardware News. But the fact they have yet write a single post, big or small about Intel's Zombieload and its implication on performance worries me a bit. Then there is the "Intel" benchmarks as usual [1] on GPU. Trying to suggest the 2 CPU were both running at 25W TDP to give a "fair" comparison, without mentioning the Ice-Lake U CPU were…

Their October 2018 i9 benchmark review was subtitled "Hardware and Software Security Fixes", and literally began with the following sentence:

The Spectre and Meltdown vulnerabilities made quite a splash earlier this year, forcing makers of hardware and software to release updates in order to tackle them.

https://www.anandtech.com/show/13400/intel-9th-gen-core-i9-9...

Re: Intel Announces 8 Core I9-9900KS: Every Core at 5Ghz, All the Time

#223

Post by spronkey »

ksec wrote: post #39

I used to be Pro Anandtech and consider them one of the best Sources online for Hardware News. But the fact they have yet write a single post, big or small about Intel's Zombieload and its implication on performance worries me a bit. Then there is the "Intel" benchmarks as usual [1] on GPU. Trying to suggest the 2 CPU were both running at 25W TDP to give a "fair" comparison, without mentioning the Ice-Lake U CPU were…

Anandtech went downhill when they lost Anand. Not sure what the hell he could possibly be doing do that's useful to Apple, but the conspiracy theorist in me wants to think it was Apple getting him out of the media.

Re: Intel Announces 8 Core I9-9900KS: Every Core at 5Ghz, All the Time

#224

Post by nl »

fwip wrote: post #201
hmottestad wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a very good point. I hope AMD brings it up with the EU. Might be a very slow process though, but at this point it is anticompetitive behaviour. AMD could probably squeeze a fair bit more performance out of their processors if they were allowed to cut some security corners.

Who do you think is disallowing AMD from cutting security corners? (Not rhetorical)

No one "allowed" Intel to cut security corners. It was an oversight and took a long time to discover and understand the impact of.

Even when people started speculating (ha!) that speculative execution could be problematic it took years before they managed to exploit it.

Re: Intel Announces 8 Core I9-9900KS: Every Core at 5Ghz, All the Time

#225

Post by spronkey »

ulzeraj wrote: post #216
zanny wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Their design for 10nm and the implementation didn't line up. Whatever their (still undisclosed) problems were, the entire node was fundamentally flawed. It might have been hubris at having been at the cutting edge of fab tech for so long. It could have just been the fruits of pushing the envelope - sometimes what you predict will happen when you put theory to application proves false. It has warped their business hea…

I've seen some recent tests showing that bulldozer is quite competitive with new multithreaded friendly stuff like DX12 and Vulkan. Roughly saying... if you think of it as a rematch against the same intel products then bulldozer can win on lots of situations.

It's certainly better at multithreaded workloads than single threaded. But performance per watt is nowhere near Intel or Ryzen parts.

Re: Intel Announces 8 Core I9-9900KS: Every Core at 5Ghz, All the Time

#226

Post by spronkey »

robocat wrote: post #150
Wowfunhappy wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And iPhones still don't come close to competing with desktop-class processors in terms of performance. iPhones also use much less electricity, of course, but the point remains. I don't know enough about this, but the GP's argument of "Intel hit the wall first because they were the first to reach that level of performance" makes logical sense to me.

"Apple’s iPhone Xs is faster than an iMac Pro on the Speedometer 2.0 JavaScript benchmark" Yes, Safari, but iPhones do compete with your average desktop processor (not the top end). https://macdailynews.com/2018/09/23/apples-iphone-xs-is-fast...

They can compete in certain workloads. As a computational tool however, desktop Intel CPUs can be optimized far, far beyond the capabilities of any A-series CPU.

Don't forget that Intel CPUs have things that A CPUs are missing like QuickSync, AVX2, massive PCIe interconnectivity.

Whether the A-series CPU could be modified into something competitive on that front is yet to be seen. Whether this actually matters considering the state of our compilers and software development is yet another question.

Re: Intel Announces 8 Core I9-9900KS: Every Core at 5Ghz, All the Time

#227

Post by Filligree »

atq2119 wrote: post #105
dgacmu wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Intel was ahead, and hit the wall first. Apple & AMD are not ahead, they're just catching up. I don't want to understate how big a problem that could be for Intel, of course. But they're also doing it on low margin parts, and Intel continues to make bank with their data center parts. I don't think any of this represents a short-term problem for Intel, other than the general downturn in processor sales because fewer p…

If the speculation about AMD's Rome / EPYC 2 performance is true, they have now surpassed Intel.

More accurately, AMD's 7nm processors should be ahead of Intel's 14nm processors. That's great, but it's not a huge surprise.

We've yet to see how competitive they'll be once Intel leapfrogs that 10nm node. That's assuming that they can, of course...

Re: Intel Announces 8 Core I9-9900KS: Every Core at 5Ghz, All the Time

#228

Post by spronkey »

rbanffy wrote: post #166
dgacmu wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Intel was ahead, and hit the wall first. Apple & AMD are not ahead, they're just catching up. I don't want to understate how big a problem that could be for Intel, of course. But they're also doing it on low margin parts, and Intel continues to make bank with their data center parts. I don't think any of this represents a short-term problem for Intel, other than the general downturn in processor sales because fewer p…

Intel made one single bad bet - their 10 nm process didn't work as well as they expected - and TSMC, who made the right bet, leapfrogged them. In terms of architecture and vulnerabilities, it's not prudent to bet Intel chips are more vulnerable to exploits than others - it's just that we know more about those vulnerabilities. If you want to find vulnerabilities with high impact in cloud and enterprise data centers, I…

We're not really sure yet whether TSMC have leapfrogged Intel in the longer term though. Intel's 10nm issues seem to have delayed their smaller process nodes in the medium term, but by how much is yet to be seen. It seems, for example, that Intel 7nm isn't in quite as much trouble as one might expect.

It's also naive to dismiss the possibility for Intel to have learnt a lot from some of the failures in 10nm that will prove useful in accelerating node development in the future.

Re: Intel Announces 8 Core I9-9900KS: Every Core at 5Ghz, All the Time

#229

Post by saagarjha »

Merad wrote: post #221
skavi wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

AnandTech is different. They cover μarch, and their writers clearly understand what they're talking about.

Anandtech was sold (or maybe Anand left, I don’t recall exactly) about 5-6 years ago. The depth of their technical writing isn’t what it used to be.

Anand left to work for Apple in 2014.

Re: Intel Announces 8 Core I9-9900KS: Every Core at 5Ghz, All the Time

#230

Post by Filligree »

dodobirdlord wrote: post #185
jjeaff wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But what does that really mean? They still seem to be producing the fastest processors available for desktop and server. It doesnt matter if someone else is making even a 3nm chip if the chip still can't outperform the current offerings.

The sizing numbers are also just nonsense marketing. They stopped meaning anything in particular a long time ago. Intel's '10nm' and TSMC's '7nm' are about the same size.

The size numbers do measure something, but what they're measuring differs between manufacturers.

They aren't comparable between AMD and Intel. They absolutely are comparable between Intel and Intel.

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