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The Huawei Disaster Reveals Google’s Iron Grip on Android

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Re: The Huawei Disaster Reveals Google’s Iron Grip on Android

#321

Post by geezerjay »

writepub wrote: post #263
geezerjay wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>You can trivially install Google play store and services on 98% of the non-licensed phones in China. You mean Google's own Google Play store? Sounds like Google is in control of that one as well.

Google's Play store is Google property, isn't a part of AOSP and isn't open source. One voluntarily chooses to install play store on phones without it, or, if you're philosophically against it, use a competitor's store. Better, go build your own store, as many companies have. Or sideload apps. Heck, build your own phone when. All possible because Google does NOT exert influence on the open source parts of Android, sp…

It seems you've missed the point.

Additinally, the Apple whataboutism is a non-sequitur that adds zero to the discussion.

Re: The Huawei Disaster Reveals Google’s Iron Grip on Android

#322

Post by CountSessine »

harryf wrote: post #34
Roritharr wrote: post #9

Google invested Billions into Android. Samsung tried to hedge for this by building Tizen(Bada) and realized how much needed to be invested to get an Android competitor going, so they kept the development going, but focused for their Smartwatches, as this would have to be a "if the worst happens" plan, not something that could be a profitable venture. LG has the Palm/HP borne WebOS for their TVs, i suspect with a simi…

It’s possible that Google cutting off Huawei will actually backfire, because it makes having a viable alternative to Android a MUST HAVE instead of just NICE TO HAVE. Perhaps it’s possible to resurrect Blackberry 10 ( https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/BlackBerry_10 ) for example, which seemed to be an impressive piece of engineering that got trampled by Blackberrys failing business. I played with a demo once that could…

It’s possible that Google cutting off Huawei will actually backfire, because it makes having a viable alternative to Android a MUST HAVE instead of just NICE TO HAVE.

It's a must-have for the small companies like Xiaomi that only or mostly make smartphones. But they can't afford to develop an android alternative.

Huawei and Samsung make lots of things other than smartphones and can just leave the market if need be. It's less expensive for both of them to shutter their smartphone business than it is to develop a viable android alternative that developers would want to code for and that consumers would want to use.

Either way think it’s going to lead to more mobile OS competition again, which is a good thing

Unlikely.

Re: The Huawei Disaster Reveals Google’s Iron Grip on Android

#323

Post by microtherion »

_Understated_ wrote: post #136
Roritharr wrote: post #9

Google invested Billions into Android. Samsung tried to hedge for this by building Tizen(Bada) and realized how much needed to be invested to get an Android competitor going, so they kept the development going, but focused for their Smartwatches, as this would have to be a "if the worst happens" plan, not something that could be a profitable venture. LG has the Palm/HP borne WebOS for their TVs, i suspect with a simi…

I wonder at what point it makes sense for Samsung, HP, Huawei, LG etc. to get together to make another OS... they sell a lot of phones across the globe. Hell, even include Microsoft in there too.

I'm wondering whether it would make sense for the Chinese government to sponsor a phone OS. That would take care of the collective action problem a single manufacturer would face, would make it harder for other countries to employ the strong arm tactics current used with Android, and would help the Chinese government enforce their own censorship and surveillance priorities.

Re: The Huawei Disaster Reveals Google’s Iron Grip on Android

#324

Post by birksherty »

ehonda wrote: post #159
harryf wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s possible that Google cutting off Huawei will actually backfire, because it makes having a viable alternative to Android a MUST HAVE instead of just NICE TO HAVE. Perhaps it’s possible to resurrect Blackberry 10 ( https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/BlackBerry_10 ) for example, which seemed to be an impressive piece of engineering that got trampled by Blackberrys failing business. I played with a demo once that could…

I have both an S9 and a BlackBerry Q10 on me every day. The BB10 OS, even though its now defunct, was designed in a way that it is FAR easier and more practical to use. I really, really hate the Android interface as a result. 1: BlackBerry hub is a lot nicer to view messages 2: Smart use of Bezel gestures makes it much easier to actually interact with the phone: -If you want to access the hub while using an app, you…

How the buttons that are always there cumbersome?

I personally don't like gestures. You have to remember and get used to them. Then suddenly in a major update they will change everything to new "cooler" gesture, re-learn and get used to it again. Year after year that happens.

Compare that to buttons. You can always see them, so no need to remember anything. Older people also able to use them.

Of course new shiny mobile os have mixed both together and now we are guinea pigs of modern UI.

Re: The Huawei Disaster Reveals Google’s Iron Grip on Android

#325

Post by tw04 »

djrogers wrote: post #251
tw04 wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Had blackberry made messenger multi-platform 15 years ago, and released an email app for iOS and Android they would still own the business market. Even in 2019 email sucks on a modern smartphone compared to blackberry in 2004. I'm still hoping Apple wakes up and releases messenger for Windows and Android before that ship sails. They claim to be a services company but they still can't seem to let go of tying it to dev…

> They claim to be a services company but they still can't seem to let go of tying it to devices. They've shipped apple music on Andriod since day 1, have had it on Sonos for several years, and in the last 6 months have announced & started to ship TV on tons of actual TVs and non-apple straming boxes. They've 'let go' of tying services to devices, but iMessage isn't a paid service so the advantage to shipping it on o…

>They've shipped apple music on Andriod since day 1

They acquired a product (beast music) that already had an Android version and didn't deprecate it, congrats?

>have had it on Sonos for several years

Sonos had to pay a license and write the code... I'm not sure I'd hold that up as an example of them being open.

> started to ship TV on tons of actual TVs and non-apple straming boxes.

Literally hasn't been released and isn't scheduled to be until "Fall of 2019".

>They've 'let go' of tying services to devices, but iMessage isn't a paid service so the advantage to shipping it on other platforms is lower.

Right, so charge for Messenger on other platforms. Nobody asked them to give it away.

Re: The Huawei Disaster Reveals Google’s Iron Grip on Android

#326

Post by Silhouette »

HillaryBriss wrote: post #264
Silhouette wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Trump's used the nuclear option, which may well work in the short term but in the long term this has shown China and others that they have to get rid of their reliance on US tech and companies as a matter of national security. Indeed. Trump's heavy-handed approach in recent weeks seems likely to have far-reaching implications, and presumably the results won't be favourable for Western businesses hoping to expand more…

> ironically it also seems like US consumers are the ones ultimately paying most of the cost of those trade barriers Consumers will pay more but I'm not as sure about the irony. Couldn't it be that the intent is to reduce US consumption of Chinese imported goods? Couldn't the policy's intent simply be to shift the economy ever so slightly away from consumption and toward production?

Couldn't the policy's intent simply be to shift the economy ever so slightly away from consumption and toward production?

It certainly could be, but I think how credible that is depends on the goods affected. If they are essentials and there is competition from elsewhere, the barriers make China less competitive, and US customers will presumably go for the best deal to minimise their losses. If they are non-essentials, the barriers also make them less attractive, and again China loses out. But if they are essentials and China is the only game in town, import tariffs look a lot like a tax on the US market.

Re: The Huawei Disaster Reveals Google’s Iron Grip on Android

#327

Post by votepaunchy »

tw04 wrote: post #325
djrogers wrote: post #251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They claim to be a services company but they still can't seem to let go of tying it to devices. They've shipped apple music on Andriod since day 1, have had it on Sonos for several years, and in the last 6 months have announced & started to ship TV on tons of actual TVs and non-apple straming boxes. They've 'let go' of tying services to devices, but iMessage isn't a paid service so the advantage to shipping it on o…

>They've shipped apple music on Andriod since day 1 They acquired a product (beast music) that already had an Android version and didn't deprecate it, congrats? >have had it on Sonos for several years Sonos had to pay a license and write the code... I'm not sure I'd hold that up as an example of them being open. > started to ship TV on tons of actual TVs and non-apple straming boxes. Literally hasn't been released an…

>> started to ship TV on tons of actual TVs and non-apple straming boxes.

> Literally hasn't been released and isn't scheduled to be until "Fall of 2019".

“A whole new world of entertainment just opened up, because the Apple TV app is now available on select 2018 and 2019 Samsung TVs...”

https://www.samsung.com/us/support/answer/ANS00082624/

Re: The Huawei Disaster Reveals Google’s Iron Grip on Android

#328

Post by ptx »

ehonda wrote: post #159
harryf wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s possible that Google cutting off Huawei will actually backfire, because it makes having a viable alternative to Android a MUST HAVE instead of just NICE TO HAVE. Perhaps it’s possible to resurrect Blackberry 10 ( https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/BlackBerry_10 ) for example, which seemed to be an impressive piece of engineering that got trampled by Blackberrys failing business. I played with a demo once that could…

I have both an S9 and a BlackBerry Q10 on me every day. The BB10 OS, even though its now defunct, was designed in a way that it is FAR easier and more practical to use. I really, really hate the Android interface as a result. 1: BlackBerry hub is a lot nicer to view messages 2: Smart use of Bezel gestures makes it much easier to actually interact with the phone: -If you want to access the hub while using an app, you…

> And you are also less likely to lose track of what windows you have open. I find lots of peoples android phones have like 30 windows open - this is a fault of its interface.

There is no need to keep track of them or close them, since the app lifecycle is managed automatically by the system – having a window (called activity on Android) open doesn't mean that the app is running.

Non-foreground activities are automatically suspended by the system and resumed when you return to them. Processes with suspended activites are automacially killed when resources run low.

Re: The Huawei Disaster Reveals Google’s Iron Grip on Android

#329

Post by ptx »

nextos wrote: post #174
ehonda wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have both an S9 and a BlackBerry Q10 on me every day. The BB10 OS, even though its now defunct, was designed in a way that it is FAR easier and more practical to use. I really, really hate the Android interface as a result. 1: BlackBerry hub is a lot nicer to view messages 2: Smart use of Bezel gestures makes it much easier to actually interact with the phone: -If you want to access the hub while using an app, you…

BB10 is nice. Meego, as seen in the Nokia N9 was a really good UI too. Extremely elegant card interface, that meshed so well with a curved OLED screen. In 2011. I would love to see an alternative to the iOS / Android duopoly. One way to go would be a better F-Droid ecosystem, and pure AOSP. But perhaps, even better, a true Linux userland. Maemo lives on with Jolla. Although I hate they still have many closed componen…

Maybe the Purism Librem 5? https://puri.sm/products/librem-5/

The UI is still very much a work in progress, though. But it's fully open source. Based on GNOME.

Re: The Huawei Disaster Reveals Google’s Iron Grip on Android

#330

Post by ptx »

NicoJuicy wrote: post #265
jdright wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

After this fiasco, I'm more than ever willing to change to Huawei. Best yet if they change to a platform not based on Android. I'm done with Google (and Android soon) in every possible way.

Uh, so an app store without: Netflix, YouTube, WhatsApp, Facebook, Gmail, Outlook, Chromecast, Dropbox, OneDrive, YouTube, Twitter, Google search ( or duck duck go), Amazon, Amazon video, 2fa authenticator, iftt, Wikipedia, Skype, messenger, Snapchat, Instagram, Waze, Google maps, Ted, Wolfram Alpha, ... I'm pretty sure there is one of them that you use recurringly. You're going to use that OS? The only Chinese app I…

You don't need apps for Google search, Wikipedia or Amazon, and I don't think this ban is going to extend to blocking websites for western consumers using Huawei devices.

The others I don't use, so it would be OK for me.

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