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Google suspends some business with Huawei

reuters.com

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Re: Google suspends some business with Huawei

#451

Post by jmkni »

morpheuskafka wrote: post #280
yskchu wrote: post #276

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The difference between Huawei's situation and Microsoft's situation is that Microsoft's app store is not compatible with Android or IOS (obviously, different OS) While if Huawei uses the Android open source base, the only thing they have to do is entice developers to submit another copy of their app to their store, which is a much lower barrier than the one MS faced to develop a whole new ecosystem

Not if that app depends on Google Play Services, which most developers targeting "Android" take for granted.

I guess they could provide their own implementations of the Google Play Services API's?

Re: Google suspends some business with Huawei

#452

Post by rasz »

gonvaled wrote: post #343
rasz wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Like building Putin gas pipeline behind EUs back?

Behing the EU's back? The project is public since years. The former German chancellor is publicly involved in it. The project is very much European: lots of countries involved. Why can't the EU buy gas from wherever we want? Who is the the US to tell us where to buy our gas from?

Project is so European it goes against interests of 1/3 EU: Czech Republic, Hungary, Poland, the Slovak Republic, Romania, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, and Croatia. Its not "EU buy gas from wherever we want", Its Germany making deals with Russia once again, remember Ribbentrop/Molotov? Russia is already hard at work making you forget https://www.haaretz.com/world-news/.premium-after-russian-pr..., buying gas from Russia while bypassing other EU member states.

Re: Google suspends some business with Huawei

#453

Post by hrktb »

rayiner wrote: post #396
windexh8er wrote: post #274

This isn't surprising. What the US government wants the government gets. I was working for a large ISP in 2010-2011 and we were considering long haul transport gear between Huawei and Infinera. All things being equal Huawei had a better cost/performance value prop. That was, until the FBI came in with a heavy handed opinion. You see at that point in time the best place to siphon data was at large ingress/egress. As I…

Pretty much every developed country has some framework for collecting electronic data pursuant to legal process: https://tmt.bakermckenzie.com/-/media/minisites/tmt/files/20... . Country after country has decided that the government should have access to that information to perform legitimate government law enforcement functions. (The process can be abused, sure, but the functionality must be present to permit entire…

> If you were a maritime shipper in the 1700s, you’d have to respond to law enforcement requests for information about the goods you transported on behalf of suspects

Tell me if I am mistaken, but in these specific case it looks more to me like forbidding customers and companies from using foreign made secure vaults because the government can't force them to secretly provide a master key.

Then sure, the argument is also valid that these vault makers could be providing a master key to their respective governments, but that would be a different argument and different enforcement.

Re: Google suspends some business with Huawei

#454

Post by nisa »

rasz wrote: post #452
gonvaled wrote: post #343

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Behing the EU's back? The project is public since years. The former German chancellor is publicly involved in it. The project is very much European: lots of countries involved. Why can't the EU buy gas from wherever we want? Who is the the US to tell us where to buy our gas from?

Project is so European it goes against interests of 1/3 EU: Czech Republic, Hungary, Poland, the Slovak Republic, Romania, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, and Croatia. Its not "EU buy gas from wherever we want", Its Germany making deals with Russia once again, remember Ribbentrop/Molotov? Russia is already hard at work making you forget https://www.haaretz.com/world-news/.premium-after-russian-pr... , buying gas from Rus…

It's still in the public and debated - even if controversial - quite a difference to blackmail behind closed-doors...

Re: Google suspends some business with Huawei

#455

Post by pbhjpbhj »

zwaps wrote: post #225
pbhjpbhj wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which USA and USA based companies would never do; praise God for the USA defending us all from giving our money to their industrial opponents, right?

To be fair, Apple has been fighting tooth and nail against the FBI decrypting their phones. Huawei, ZTE and consorts are literally owned by PRC cadre and are actively involved in infrastructure to spy on and terrorize minority groups in China, as well as getting caught spying and stealing IP abroad. I think there is no need to answer each post with Whataboutism, especially when the comparision is to tilted against Ch…

>Apple has been fighting tooth and nail against the FBI decrypting their phones //

The problem is, for me, it's impossible to know if that's true or if that's the external appearance that's been designed. Nearly everyone in Apple wouldn't know either. Legally, it seems, NSA letters could force such a situation.

AIR the much publicised event of 'FBI wanted to open someone's phone and Apple wouldn't' ultimately ended in a third party enabling it. So, this could easily have gone down that Apple said "we can't do that because it will kill our privacy angle in the market" and the FBI say "well just pass on the info to this third party" [eg some key needed to sign updates; or an update that decrypts all internal memories and dumps them to a port on boot, or whatever].

That's entirely undiscoverable and serves the interest of both FBI and Apple, FBI ideally want to have "backdoors" where it's publicly known "there is no backdoor".

Re: Google suspends some business with Huawei

#456

Post by tgragnato »

dafsdfasdfsa wrote: post #401
antocv wrote: post #399

Earlier quoted context omitted.

AFAIK nobody has reverse-engineered even parts of the radio-firmware, the separate OS which has memory access to your other OS. Linux/Android/Iphones OS, is really just a guest, a side-show to what the radio-firmware can and is doing, ie spying.

This is not true anymore. Some android phones (samsung, google), have DMA disabled and modern iphones (around 2016?) use USB or SDIO without DMA. I honestly believe that the theoretical DMA backdoor attack (and most other similar attacks) have been mitigated thoroughly. I am much more concerned about secretly held 0days (RCE) and most concerned about warrantless orders against cloud storage. https://www.apple.com/bus…

> without DMA [...] 0days (RCE) > https://www.apple.com/business/site/docs/iOS_Security_Guide.... p41

Are you citing "To protect the device from vulnerabilities in network processor firmware, network interfaces including Wi-Fi and baseband have limited access to application processor memory. When USB or SDIO is used to interface with the network processor, the network processor can’t initiate Direct Memory Access (DMA) transactions to the application processor. When PCIe is used, each network processor is on its own isolated PCIe bus. An IOMMU on each PCIe bus limits the network processor’s DMA access to pages of memory containing its network packets or control structures."? Correct?

The attention to hardware isolation and separation is appreciated, but I don't hold my breath for iBoot and SEPOS protecting an iPhone from powerful adversaries.

Re: Google suspends some business with Huawei

#457

Post by ramblerman »

PixyMisa wrote: post #349
timkly wrote: post #321

As an Australian with a Hauwei phone, the writing is on the wall for me. Google Android in no longer a universal platform and moving forward, I doubt I'll ever buy anything again Google or US related again in terms of tech. This si no longer a China vs US issue, it's the US vs the world.

It's a China vs. the world issue. China has been spying on everyone, for years. Political, military, commercial, makes no difference.

> It's a China vs. the world issue. China has been spying on everyone, for years. Political, military, commercial, makes no difference.

So has the US though, even on it's allies as Snowden showed us.

Re: Google suspends some business with Huawei

#458

Post by crdoconnor »

pbhjpbhj wrote: post #127
crdoconnor wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Motives: * Trump has been on at China for a long time. * US establishment growing increasingly worried about the sophistication of Chinese tech and are viewing Huawei as a strategic threat. Especially since the latest generation of Chinese telecoms tech has arguably leapfrogged western offerings. Free trade works brilliantly until you stop being the top dog. * NSA doesn't the idea of Chinese being able to use their t…

BBC Click covered the issue https://youtu.be/yCzNHi9TBCQ?t=690 onwards. They say Huawei claim to be 18months ahead [12m35] of everyone with 5G, and their interview with UK's intelligence advisor [16m20 onwards] suggested that there's not really a security problem. They do talk about [17m04+] the possibility of the network being shutdown and the fallout of that, and have a dramatisation.

It's not current security issues they're worried about it's future potential security problems at the point where we are utterly reliant on Huawei.

Nonetheless the NSA is trying to pretend that Huawei is currently installing backdoors.

Re: Google suspends some business with Huawei

#459

Post by slantaclaus »

dx034 wrote: post #410
PixyMisa wrote: post #349

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a China vs. the world issue. China has been spying on everyone, for years. Political, military, commercial, makes no difference.

For the EU it's really just the question if you want to be spied on by the US or by China. In recent years, trade with China has probably helped the economy much more than trade with the US. At the same time, China (while certainly acting out of self interest), is somewhat predictable in their actions. Europeans are really critical of China and their policies (esp. their human rights record). But they don't like the…

Correct me if I’m wrong but if you get an Apple phone you’ll be spied on by no one. Relatively speaking, of course.

Re: Google suspends some business with Huawei

#460

Post by rchaud »

seppin wrote: post #406
ghobs91 wrote: post #209

To all those stating that Huawei should just make their own OS, it's nowhere near that simple. Forking Android is the easy part, building an app ecosystem that thousands of developers across the globe actively partake in is incredibly difficult. Microsoft couldn't even pull it off with Windows Phone. I predict their own Android fork and China-focused app store will do fine in China, but struggle big time in other mar…

> I predict their own Android fork and China-focused app store will do fine in China, but struggle big time in other markets. Why would they need it to be popular anywhere other than China?

Because they have spent years trying to increase market share in Europe and South America, and are only now seeing the fruits of that labor. In the Chinese market they have to compete on price against Xiaomi, Oppo and many, many others, whereas in overseas markets their offerings (minus the P30 flagship) have a big price advantage over Samsung and Apple.
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