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Seattle police use family DNA, latest science to identify killer 52 years later

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Re: Seattle police use family DNA, latest science to identify killer 52 years later

#151

Getting your DNA sequenced is a bit like letting an app have access to your contacts: in both, your choice has consequences for hundreds of other people. Unfortunately it doesn’t seem like it’s possible to undo the effects of something your friends/family might have done :/

What possible concern could you have unless you are a serial killer?

Re: Seattle police use family DNA, latest science to identify killer 52 years later

#152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it won't use your body's organs to save other human beings, without your express consent No longer true here in NL: https://edition.cnn.com/2018/02/14/health/new-dutch-law-orga...

I blame the Predictably Irrational guy for making opt out so popular world-wide. I personally find it abhorrent. I used to be an organ donor before they made it opt-out in argentina: after that in protest I took myself out.

Can you elaborate about this? I can't really see reasons for outside of superstition and clinging to false hopes to be against it being opt out; and even on an opt out system, I find that doctors still "request" the permissions to the family because no one wants to deal with unnecessary legal trouble.

Even following the anti authoritarian reasoning, which I'm kind of fond, I find it silly to worry about this, with all the stuff the state decides over your life.

Re: Seattle police use family DNA, latest science to identify killer 52 years later

#153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure. I signed up for organ donation.

I think signing up for organ donation means you do care about what happens to your body. You care that someone gets something out of it!

I think it means you care about what happens to other people. Your body is just a means to an end.

Re: Seattle police use family DNA, latest science to identify killer 52 years later

#154
post #146
post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Once you are dead it is no longer your body. The dead have no rights. None whatsoever.

This is a faith statement not based in objective fact. Materialism has this to say about the dead; other religions express their beliefs differently.

Objective fact has provided a ton of evidence for materialism and very little for any alternative.

Re: Seattle police use family DNA, latest science to identify killer 52 years later

#155
post #59
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you’re dead, what do you care what happens to your remains? I see no problem with exhuming a corpse to solve a murder case as long as there’s probable cause and a warrant, which there was here.

> If you’re dead, what do you care what happens to your remains? Because our society believes in body autonomy, to the point that it won't use your body's organs to save other human beings, without your express consent. Your body is your property, and it takes a damn good reason for someone else to access your property, contrary to your will.

Our society also believes that probable cause and a warrant qualify as “a damn good reason.”

Re: Seattle police use family DNA, latest science to identify killer 52 years later

#156
post #56

I find it disconcerting that someone's remains would be violated due to being a murder suspect. This is one of many reasons to have your remains cremated, I suppose. It also avoids wasting space in a graveyard and whatnot. I'm beginning to seriously hear people discuss that it's perfectly okay to use DNA people submit in these ways and even that it would be okay for the government to collect trash and other things th…

I would worry about a mistake. If the dna match comes back as a match, is anyone going to disbelieve some super cool CSI stuff?

Forensic DNA is used to find a suspect, who is then confirmed by traditional DNA testing. It's lead generation, and is not itself used in court.

If you are ok with traditional DNA testing, this should not cause you are concern. Unless you have something to hide, like say you fathered a child somewhere and ran off, your identity unknown to the mother.

Re: Seattle police use family DNA, latest science to identify killer 52 years later

#157
post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, opt-out is quite common nowadays - Spain, Portugal, Croatia, Belgium, Austria, Colombia, Chile, etc. I think in some cases the family must still be consulted.

People in persistent vegetative states or even comas are likely to become rarer in such countries, I'd suspect.

Is that supposed to be a bad thing? If I were in such a state with no hope of recovery, I’d want to die ASAP.

Re: Seattle police use family DNA, latest science to identify killer 52 years later

#158
post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

David, your claim that these cases used 500,000 markers on both sides of the "match" is absolutely incorrect and 100% total nonsense. Hey post your evidence that the police presented a full sequence for the match. You know you don't have that data. Also, I'd like to take this opportunity to formally and publically request that the company you are a high level employee of, 23andme, immediately publish a full disclosur…

Most of this new class of DNA searches, including the one in the article, are being carried out by Parabon NanoLabs: http://docs.parabon.com/pub/Parabon_Snapshot_Scientific_Post... https://www.genomeweb.com/applied-markets/parabon-nanolabs-g... [sorry, paywalled]: "Parabon uses Illumina’s SNP microarray platform. It doesn't disclose which particular array product it uses but said that the array contains more than 98…

DNA is not medical data? It's obvious that it is and disingenuous to pretend it is not in order to avoid compliance with the law.

Galvin's sample, along with other cold cases, was pulled out of evidence storage and analyzed in 2002. Your assertion is that that analysis did not in fact use the legal tools at the time for this, but instead used the microarray Paradon currently uses with the same ~700k SNP points, and that this microarray was somehow commercially available and being used by law enforcement to analyze cold cases in 2002? That is a remarkable claim.

Re: Seattle police use family DNA, latest science to identify killer 52 years later

#159

Getting your DNA sequenced is a bit like letting an app have access to your contacts: in both, your choice has consequences for hundreds of other people. Unfortunately it doesn’t seem like it’s possible to undo the effects of something your friends/family might have done :/

What possible concern could you have unless you are a serial killer?

This is data that can't be taken back once the government has it. I wish people would take the concept of the government as adversary more seriously. For example, technology is used as a tool of oppression against Uighurs in Xinjiang, LGBT people in the middle east, malcontents in any number of regimes around the world.

The US is comparatively not so oppressive, but there are still plenty of unjust laws on the books and plenty of vengeful prosecutors out there. Even for those convicted of what one might rightly consider a crime, in the vast majority of those cases the punishments are designed to be more effective at "retribution" than "correction". I think it matters to be vigilant when governments are probing the boundaries of what techniques are acceptable.

Re: Seattle police use family DNA, latest science to identify killer 52 years later

#160
post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Once you are dead it is no longer your body. The dead have no rights. None whatsoever.

Might be a technicality thing, but with that logic as soon as you are dead all your estate is up for grabs by anyone. If your body is your posession like your house or your car, then you have the right to do what you want with it.

It is up for grabs. Die as the victim of a violent crime and guess how much power your estate has to prevent an autopsy. Die of a virulent communicable disease and guess how much power your estate has to prevent your body from being cremated and the pathogens within rendered as inert as possible.

Your body is your possession like your house or your car, and I am sure you can image how often a clear legal directive like a will is placed before a state body like a court and judgement passed.

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