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Close to 735k Fraudulently Obtained IP Addresses Uncovered and Revoked

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Re: Close to 735k Fraudulently Obtained IP Addresses Uncovered and Revoked

#31

Post by icedchai »

Arnt wrote: post #22
School-Cotton wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is an active, mature market for IPv4 addresses (just google "IPv4 address broker"), so it stands to reason that there are people hoarding them for speculation. It's not free money, of course -- it's entirely possible that the value goes down, as things that reduce the pressure on the IPv4 address space slowly come online (CGNAT and IPv6) That said, I'm a bit confused by this story. ARIN ran out of addresses in…

IIRC you can get a laughably small number from ARIN if you say the right things, and you could get a slightly less laughably number in the past. Try saying you're an ISP and all your customers are dualstack already but you need 128 v4 addresses for compatibility or CGNAT or your DNS caches or something.

Good luck routing anything more specific than a /24 (256 addresses) globally.

Re: Close to 735k Fraudulently Obtained IP Addresses Uncovered and Revoked

#32

Post by bvdba »

Arnt wrote: post #25
bvdba wrote: post #16

If we could recover all IP addresses that are not in use now (especially from those who got a /8) we would breath some air, given that ipv6 is basically not happening.

At what share of deployment would you consider v6 as happening — 10%? 20%? 40%? 60%? 80%? 90? Or would you require even more than 100% of the people who have v4 access?

When it becomes viable to market IPv6-only home connections.

Re: Close to 735k Fraudulently Obtained IP Addresses Uncovered and Revoked

#33

Post by _JamesA_ »

Not sure if it's related or not but I was receiving spammy e-mails for a while from "Admiral Hosting":

"Mike Watson here, from Admiral Hosting. I'm touching base regarding a business opportunity. Have you ever thought about turning your IP's into profit on a monthly basis? Admiral Hosting handles dozens of such B2B projects and its dedicated technical team oversees each project’s implementation."

Re: Close to 735k Fraudulently Obtained IP Addresses Uncovered and Revoked

#34

Post by brianwawok »

jonawesomegreen wrote: post #7

I've often wondered how much of the IPv4 address space is legacy allocations that are not at all being fully utilized. Perhaps the market for IPv4 addresses has worked this out, and anyone that has such an allocation has cashed in.

For enough dollars you can sample 100k address at random and have a decent guess?

Not everyone responds to a ping but I suspect most do

Re: Close to 735k Fraudulently Obtained IP Addresses Uncovered and Revoked

#35

Post by freedomben »

alexpotato wrote: post #29
spydum wrote: post #2

I always wondered if someone had created a biz for the purpose of hoarding IPv4 with intent to “sell them”. We talked about this kind of abuse back in the 90s when I worked for a hosting company. Part of my job was filling out ARIN templates and SWIP and all that nonsense. Justification was easy, but it occurred to me how easy it would be to fake requests and just pay the trivial fees. There were already some busines…

This reminds me of a conversation I had with the AC repairman last year. Backstory: we have an old AC unit that uses freon. The repairman mentioned that freon is no longer available for new AC units. I asked if you could still buy freon and he said yes, existing supplies were grandfathered in. I then commented that the price of freon must have sky-rocketed and he said: "yes, it did for a while but then it became chea…

I had an 88 Chevy Pickup Truck that used the old style freon (R12). Man that stuff worked so good. In 100 degree heat that truck would stay nice and cold. It took over 20 years before the alternatives were competitive.

Re: Close to 735k Fraudulently Obtained IP Addresses Uncovered and Revoked

#36

Post by freedomben »

brianwawok wrote: post #34
jonawesomegreen wrote: post #7

I've often wondered how much of the IPv4 address space is legacy allocations that are not at all being fully utilized. Perhaps the market for IPv4 addresses has worked this out, and anyone that has such an allocation has cashed in.

For enough dollars you can sample 100k address at random and have a decent guess? Not everyone responds to a ping but I suspect most do

ICMP is blocked by default now in many firewall setups, so unless the admin specifically allows ICMP the packets will likely be dropped.

Also, be careful as "host discovery" can be viewed as a type of "hacking" depending on who you are and who is watching/judging you.

Re: Close to 735k Fraudulently Obtained IP Addresses Uncovered and Revoked

#37

Post by freedomben »

icedchai wrote: post #24
bvdba wrote: post #16

If we could recover all IP addresses that are not in use now (especially from those who got a /8) we would breath some air, given that ipv6 is basically not happening.

How is IPv6 not happening? Google shows pretty good growth: https://www.google.com/intl/en/ipv6/statistics.html

I've been seeing more and more pressure to support IPv6 in the various SaaS companies I've worked at. I do think it's happening.

That said I tend to think LANs and VPCs will continue to use IPv4 internally for decades even if the load balancer does IPv6.

Re: Close to 735k Fraudulently Obtained IP Addresses Uncovered and Revoked

#38

Post by rdtsc »

alexpotato wrote: post #29
spydum wrote: post #2

I always wondered if someone had created a biz for the purpose of hoarding IPv4 with intent to “sell them”. We talked about this kind of abuse back in the 90s when I worked for a hosting company. Part of my job was filling out ARIN templates and SWIP and all that nonsense. Justification was easy, but it occurred to me how easy it would be to fake requests and just pay the trivial fees. There were already some busines…

This reminds me of a conversation I had with the AC repairman last year. Backstory: we have an old AC unit that uses freon. The repairman mentioned that freon is no longer available for new AC units. I asked if you could still buy freon and he said yes, existing supplies were grandfathered in. I then commented that the price of freon must have sky-rocketed and he said: "yes, it did for a while but then it became chea…

I know someone who was hoarding banned freon and selling it on the side. The government eventually had caught on that people were doing it, but they also understood that punishing people even harder for selling it wouldn't work. So instead they started to provide incentives to convert refrigeration units to not use that kind of freon. It's been a few years so not sure how effective that was, but I thought it was interesting.

Re: Close to 735k Fraudulently Obtained IP Addresses Uncovered and Revoked

#39

Post by lordnacho »

alexpotato wrote: post #29
spydum wrote: post #2

I always wondered if someone had created a biz for the purpose of hoarding IPv4 with intent to “sell them”. We talked about this kind of abuse back in the 90s when I worked for a hosting company. Part of my job was filling out ARIN templates and SWIP and all that nonsense. Justification was easy, but it occurred to me how easy it would be to fake requests and just pay the trivial fees. There were already some busines…

This reminds me of a conversation I had with the AC repairman last year. Backstory: we have an old AC unit that uses freon. The repairman mentioned that freon is no longer available for new AC units. I asked if you could still buy freon and he said yes, existing supplies were grandfathered in. I then commented that the price of freon must have sky-rocketed and he said: "yes, it did for a while but then it became chea…

Fridge related trick:

In certain countries you could get carbon credits for closing down old factories that made old style CFC fridges, because of course those are not great for the environment.

So then some wily operators started building new "old factories" that they could get credits for in order to "convert" to new factories.

Story was told by a friend of mine in the industry at the time, I don't recall the finer details.

Re: Close to 735k Fraudulently Obtained IP Addresses Uncovered and Revoked

#40

Post by quickthrower2 »

bvdba wrote: post #32
Arnt wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At what share of deployment would you consider v6 as happening — 10%? 20%? 40%? 60%? 80%? 90? Or would you require even more than 100% of the people who have v4 access?

When it becomes viable to market IPv6-only home connections.

Sounds like 99-100% then
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