There's a great documentary about this, called _Into Eternity_. Highly recommended.
This Place Is Not a Place of Honor (1992)
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Re: This Place Is Not a Place of Honor (1992)
#42Maybe we are thinking of this with too much of a helicopter parents view. If there was a high exposure death area, and a way to easily send an animal into it, the truth and reality of the danger there would be very easy to convey.
Yeah, pretty sure any advanced civilization will quickly figure out "hey this place is pretty radioactive; we shouldn't stick around", while any primitive civilization will quickly figure out "hey this place is definitely cursed; we shouldn't stick around".
Having a visual cue there (I like the jagged pointy structures) would certainly help reinforce that and/or delineate exactly where the radioactive/cursed place actually is.
Re: This Place Is Not a Place of Honor (1992)
#43I've actually thought about this quite a lot. Not because I have an expertise in the matter--I don't. But because it's such a fascinating thought experiment. My proposed solution goes something like this: It is hard to convey that there is nothing of value and only danger within. So what if you just made the site actually dangerous on the surface? Is it possible to build something like a lake of acid that would make…
Given enough time, literally anything that indicates the slightest bit of "don't go in here" will make someone ask "why go to the trouble if it isn't valuable?
I'm pretty sure the only way to keep people out is to hide it.
Re: This Place Is Not a Place of Honor (1992)
#44I've actually thought about this quite a lot. Not because I have an expertise in the matter--I don't. But because it's such a fascinating thought experiment. My proposed solution goes something like this: It is hard to convey that there is nothing of value and only danger within. So what if you just made the site actually dangerous on the surface? Is it possible to build something like a lake of acid that would make…
> Is it possible to build something like a lake of acid that would make the area uninhabitable
Given that the site is supposed to be designed to store barrels of nuclear waste, burying them under a lake of acid seems somewhat counterproductive.
Re: This Place Is Not a Place of Honor (1992)
#45I've actually thought about this quite a lot. Not because I have an expertise in the matter--I don't. But because it's such a fascinating thought experiment. My proposed solution goes something like this: It is hard to convey that there is nothing of value and only danger within. So what if you just made the site actually dangerous on the surface? Is it possible to build something like a lake of acid that would make…
Given enough time, literally anything that indicates the slightest bit of "don't go in here" will make someone ask "why go to the trouble if it isn't valuable? I'm pretty sure the only way to keep people out is to hide it.
The authors seemed to think hiding the site was impossible. However I find it difficult to believe it's harder to hide it than it is build massive earthworks all over it.
Re: This Place Is Not a Place of Honor (1992)
#46> We considered ourselves to be a powerful culture. For the Level 1 message I suggest a sculpture of two vast and trunkless legs of stone, over a pedestal with the words ‘My name is Ozymandias, king of kings: Look on my works, ye Mighty, and despair!'
Re: This Place Is Not a Place of Honor (1992)
#47The first thing people unfamiliar with the dangers of radiation will do, is to quarry all those dramatic spikes and walls, for usable stone.
The people studying this have generally advocated a layered defense. First, people dig up the strange stuff on the surface if they have a use for it (although it should be designed to make this difficult, expensive and not especially useful). They don't have to be especially advanced to do this, maybe. Second, perhaps they develop the ability to dig deeper and they discover more elaborate warnings. Eventually, they get to the equivalent of a vault where they've received plenty of warnings and, one hopes, are savvy enough to interpret them and make an educated choice as to whether they should proceed. (there's an assumption that wisdom, caution and linguistic ability might grow in a future society alongside the ability to prospect and dig, which might or might not work out)
The strange spikes and so on are just one possible approach. Simply hiding the stuff a mile under some salt can work and at least one site does that. I think you're going to see a ton of stuff hidden that way just because it's the path of least resistance once the regulatory permissions are secured (which is hard enough). I think this approach has been written about in the NY Times and so on.
Re: This Place Is Not a Place of Honor (1992)
#48I’m reminded of this big red sign I saw in a men’s room, just above a big red button:
“ATTENTION DO NOT PUSH RED BUTTON UNLESS IT IS AN EMERGENCY”
It took every ounce of my will power not to push the damn button.
Re: This Place Is Not a Place of Honor (1992)
#49I've actually thought about this quite a lot. Not because I have an expertise in the matter--I don't. But because it's such a fascinating thought experiment. My proposed solution goes something like this: It is hard to convey that there is nothing of value and only danger within. So what if you just made the site actually dangerous on the surface? Is it possible to build something like a lake of acid that would make…
Not a bad thought. Though I think it had some problems that they already considered.
They mention not wanting to overstate the danger ("touch this and you die") in case someone touches the rock and does NOT die, putting doubt on the whole message. I think that poisoning the area creates a similar risk.
If you poison the area then you run the risk of a future civilization cleaning up the obvious poison at the surface, thinking that the message refers to only that poison. This would leave them thinking that the area is safe after their cleanup.
Re: This Place Is Not a Place of Honor (1992)
#50I think we need only reflect on our own likely response to any conceivable attempt by a previous civilisation to so forewarn us, to realise the futility of our attempting likewise.