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Changes to Models S and X allow them to travel longer without larger batteries

tesla.com

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Re: Changes to Models S and X allow them to travel longer without larger batteries

#471

Post by rconti »

fumar wrote: post #456
woodpanel wrote: post #450

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Good point. Having driven Model S/X/3'es as well as an e-tron and i-pace I can absolutely echo your statement. Teslas offer a different USP than E-Tron/I-Pace alikes. It's EV vs. Premium-Cars that happen to be EVs. If you've never owned a (premium) car and thus have no feeling for differences in interior- and general-manufacturing-quality, a Tesla is the reasonable choice (it even maybe that an Audi's interior will c…

I have a VW Golf R and test drove a Tesla M3 last week. I had set my expectations ahead of time but I was still let down by the interior quality of the vehicle. German auto companies have a great understanding of what makes a car feel like higher quality. It is a mix of design, materials, fit, usability, and sound. VW group, Mercedes Benz, and BMW spend considerable amount of money refining the user experience. Tesla…

I sold my 2016 Golf R around the same time we picked up the 3. I actually was pleasantly surprised by the quality of the 3, to be honest. Maybe my expectations were low-ish because I spend a fair bit of time in a Model S, but I really thought they did a good job of stepping up and making the interior relatively premium. Where cars like the R feel 'premium' to me is how they glow at night. The interior just felt REALLY high end, better than a base BMW, all the glowing buttons and stuff. But the Tesla just doesn't HAVE the buttons. To me, that's different, not worse.

The nav/display is obviously better in the Tesla (although my Golf didn't have the digital cockpit that they're putting in the new ones). Both cars have their 'fancy' seating material (leather/fake leather/whatever) on the seating surfaces only, cloth elsewhere (and, by the way, I hate leather seats, I just want cloth in everything.. I'm just saying, this is one way premium cars are differentiated, is by FULL leather). The most galling thing to me on the R, the only real sign of cost cutting, was the manual passenger seat, where the 3 has a power seat. A low end touch on both is the totally spartan, stripped out finishing of the trunk/hatch area.

No swiveling headlights on the 3, but the headlights are actually better, significantly so, particularly on high beam.

Perhaps one thing that keeps me from being as critical of the 3 is that it's an appliance to me. I'm a german car fan, and I hate sedans. My BMWs and VWs have been cars I'm passionate about. The Tesla just takes me from Point A to Point B. And it's a fantastic car. But maybe that makes my expectations lower.

Re: Changes to Models S and X allow them to travel longer without larger batteries

#472

Post by rconti »

martin_bech wrote: post #254
codeulike wrote: post #250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Car batteries are not much like phone batteries. A car battery pack is a system in itself, with thousands of small cells supported by cooling, heating, monitoring and balancing systems. edit: there are recommendations for Tesla daily use that say go to 90% most of the time. But still a bit different to putting 12% completely out of reach like Audi have done.

Well actually, by default Teslas charge daily to only 90%, to preserve the battery. You can however change it to 100%, if going on a trip, or otherwise needing the full range.

There's no reason to believe 100% is actually 100%.

Re: Changes to Models S and X allow them to travel longer without larger batteries

#473

Post by war1025 »

asmosoinio wrote: post #284
asmosoinio wrote: post #280

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not super different from long lasting oil? Some Petrol cars do 30'000km without and service?

I just read up on 3'000 to 5'00 mile intervals that might be prevalent in the US? To me that sounds crazy. Many synthetic oils are officially approved to 15'000 miles.

The shop I take our cars to recommends rotating the tires every 6,000 miles. Based on the oil life indicator in the car, the oil is getting about worn out by that point as well. Makes for an easy service trip to get both done at once.

Re: Changes to Models S and X allow them to travel longer without larger batteries

#474

Post by war1025 »

windexh8er wrote: post #318
quanticle wrote: post #271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They break at much much lower rates, because they have many fewer parts. EVs don't have the pistons, valves, belts, fans, compressors, alternators, spark plugs, etc that gasoline engines have. There's probably order of magnitude fewer parts to break. Having seen the interior of an automatic gearbox, the surprising thing to me is that conventional automobiles are as reliable as they are.

> There's probably order of magnitude fewer parts to break. According to Tesla a comparative ICE drivetrain will have around 200 moving parts, while one of their vehicles will have roughly 17. The real upside is longevity. While it is a miraculous feat that machines, such as transmissions, last as long as they do today - they're not needed in electric vehicles. I think it's fair to assume we all expect 100k miles and…

Modern cars can easily go 200k+ miles without any major repairs other than tires / brakes / suspension.

Re: Changes to Models S and X allow them to travel longer without larger batteries

#476

Post by NoblePublius »

fumar wrote: post #456
woodpanel wrote: post #450

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Good point. Having driven Model S/X/3'es as well as an e-tron and i-pace I can absolutely echo your statement. Teslas offer a different USP than E-Tron/I-Pace alikes. It's EV vs. Premium-Cars that happen to be EVs. If you've never owned a (premium) car and thus have no feeling for differences in interior- and general-manufacturing-quality, a Tesla is the reasonable choice (it even maybe that an Audi's interior will c…

I have a VW Golf R and test drove a Tesla M3 last week. I had set my expectations ahead of time but I was still let down by the interior quality of the vehicle. German auto companies have a great understanding of what makes a car feel like higher quality. It is a mix of design, materials, fit, usability, and sound. VW group, Mercedes Benz, and BMW spend considerable amount of money refining the user experience. Tesla…

That’s called a Model Y :)

Re: Changes to Models S and X allow them to travel longer without larger batteries

#477

Post by alasdair_ »

lazyjones wrote: post #391
justinclift wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That $US20k seems to be purely marketing bullshit, aimed to sucker US buyers. :( Easy seen as such too. Compare the "Ludicrous Mode" for the Model X on the US website (US$20k) to the same thing on the Australian website (AUS$8.5k): https://www.tesla.com/modelx/design?redirect=no#battery https://www.tesla.com/en_AU/modelx/design?redirect=no#batter... Note - you need to select "Performance" on the right side, for Ludic…

> That $US20k seems to be purely marketing bullshit, aimed to sucker US buyers. :( Why is this a problem? In all luxury cars there are some options priced much higher than the actual cost (e.g. fancy wheels). They exist to bolster the car maker's margins and help sell the lower end versions at lower prices, so you and the average buyers profit. Nobody actually needs Ludicrous, so pricing it like this is in no way imm…

>Why is this a problem?

It's a problem because they are claiming it's a "$20,000 value" when it was sold for $5000 in the recent past and even right now, it costs far less than $20K in other countries.

I'm a huge Tesla fan (I have an S and an X already) but every time they distort the truth in such an obvious manner, it significantly erodes my trust in them. Case in point: I really like the 2020 Roadster's specs but Tesla/Musk have stretched the truth one too many times for me to put down the $50K deposit until it ships and I've let others find the first bugs.

Re: Changes to Models S and X allow them to travel longer without larger batteries

#478

Post by fumar »

rconti wrote: post #471
fumar wrote: post #456

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a VW Golf R and test drove a Tesla M3 last week. I had set my expectations ahead of time but I was still let down by the interior quality of the vehicle. German auto companies have a great understanding of what makes a car feel like higher quality. It is a mix of design, materials, fit, usability, and sound. VW group, Mercedes Benz, and BMW spend considerable amount of money refining the user experience. Tesla…

I sold my 2016 Golf R around the same time we picked up the 3. I actually was pleasantly surprised by the quality of the 3, to be honest. Maybe my expectations were low-ish because I spend a fair bit of time in a Model S, but I really thought they did a good job of stepping up and making the interior relatively premium. Where cars like the R feel 'premium' to me is how they glow at night. The interior just felt REALL…

I am swaying between the Golf R MK 7.5 and the Dual Motor M3. I have a 2017 lease right now. I agree with you that the M3 will get me from point a to b with enhanced auto pilot features and no CO2 output, but I am afraid of missing out on the joy of driving. I recently moved to LA and my time in vehicle has increased by 3x. Which means both vehicles have increased pros and cons.

Do you miss having the hatchback? That is one my bigger gripes with the M3. This would be my only car.

Re: Changes to Models S and X allow them to travel longer without larger batteries

#479

Post by alasdair_ »

AnthonyMouse wrote: post #200
justinclift wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That $US20k seems to be purely marketing bullshit, aimed to sucker US buyers. :( Easy seen as such too. Compare the "Ludicrous Mode" for the Model X on the US website (US$20k) to the same thing on the Australian website (AUS$8.5k): https://www.tesla.com/modelx/design?redirect=no#battery https://www.tesla.com/en_AU/modelx/design?redirect=no#batter... Note - you need to select "Performance" on the right side, for Ludic…

The entire feature is marketing bullshit. There is no practical utility in making a car that fast go even faster, it's sold only as weapon in the battle to express the desired length of one's phallus in vehicle form. They should charge $15,000 for the first "10% faster" and then another $25,000 on top of that for the second 10%.

>The entire feature is marketing bullshit. There is no practical utility in making a car that fast go even faster

Hardly. Ludicrous Mode is all about acceleration and it's one of the few things that you can use every day without breaking any laws. People are almost never going to go over 100MPH on any US highway but all of them will need to accelerate from zero to sixty during their drives.

Re: Changes to Models S and X allow them to travel longer without larger batteries

#480

Post by terryf »

hwillis wrote: post #417
razorunreal wrote: post #402

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Internal combustion engines throw off heat whether you want them to or not, plus the total amount of energy stored in a gas tank is vastly greater than a battery, so wasting some of it as heat is less likely to strand you. EVs only get similar range by being much more efficient, and efficiency means less energy lost to heat.

Depending on the car and the temperature you'd much rather be stranded in a Tesla (or another EV that works as well at low temperatures). A Tesla can run its heater on full blast for well over 12 hours. In ICE cars that don't have resistive heaters, the heat output is much lower at idle- think a civic or corolla. It can be risky to fall asleep in cars like this because you need to warm up the engine regularly or the…

Having slept in quite cold temperatures in cars during longer trips quite a lot of times, just having the car idle over-night has always been enough to keep the cabin warm enough to not even need a blanket. Not talking about luxury cars with huge engines either. It also uses very little fuel. After 8 hours, you can see that the fuel gauge has moved, but only very slightly. I'm pretty sure a ICE car with a full tank can idle for several days before running out of fuel.
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