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Beyond Meat S-1

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Re: Beyond Meat S-1

#411

Post by JohnFen »

Pfhreak wrote: post #108
telesilla wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm with you. I haven't eaten red meat or birds for going on 25 years now and though I do enjoy a good salmon burger, I honestly prefer a beyond burger when I can find one (trying to cut down on the fish, for health and over-fishing reasons).

I still periodically eat meat, as I mentioned I did work with a local farmer to buy a whole beef. But it's something special and deliberate -- should we make one of our roasts? We don't have very many, so each one is precious. We use all the bones we could get to make stock, etc. Try to really appreciate the one animal we've had harvested for our family, but still eat vegetarian or vegan on the vast majority of days…

> I still periodically eat meat

I have a friend who describes himself as "meegan". He's straight-up vegan in terms of his regular diet (not because of ethical issues, but because he feels better eating that way), but if he's eating out or at a friend's house, and they're not serving vegan fare, he'll eat whatever is on offer.

It seems like a rational way to go about it.

Re: Beyond Meat S-1

#412

Post by JohnFen »

kabacha wrote: post #357
Pfhreak wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I still periodically eat meat, as I mentioned I did work with a local farmer to buy a whole beef. But it's something special and deliberate -- should we make one of our roasts? We don't have very many, so each one is precious. We use all the bones we could get to make stock, etc. Try to really appreciate the one animal we've had harvested for our family, but still eat vegetarian or vegan on the vast majority of days…

> I've gone vegetarian, except for a single grass fed animal and then > still periodically eat meat I'm sorry but you shouldn't call yourself a vegetarian.

> I'm sorry but you shouldn't call yourself a vegetarian.

I understand your point, but I don't entirely agree. I think if someone's primary diet is vegetarian, calling themselves that isn't unduly misleading even if they eat meat on occasion.

But it may be a difference between being "vegetarian" in terms of participating in a movement and being "vegetarian" just because you prefer to eat that way.

Re: Beyond Meat S-1

#413

Post by JohnFen »

EliRivers wrote: post #181
Pfhreak wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What I did: stop purchasing meat from the supermarket. Stop eating meat at restaurants. Find a local farmer and source a whole animal to split with your friends. Visit the farm, meet the farmer. A whole beef is a few thousand dollars, and splits nicely into 8ths. We spent, I believe, ~$6.50/lb for organic, grass fed beef. It's more time and cost up front, but now we have a freezer full of meat to draw from when we ne…

Apropos of just shootin' the breeze, could you have also met the animal? I wonder if that would make a further difference. I eat meat, but I put my hand up and say that if I ordered a steak in a restaurant and they brought out the cow and gave me a rock, and I had to beat the cow to death with the rock myself, I think I'd change my order. I'm not trying to make any points here; just freewheeling in conversation with…

> and they brought out the cow and gave me a rock, and I had to beat the cow to death with the rock myself, I think I'd change my order.

So would I, but maybe for different reasons. Aside from the method of killing (bashing the poor thing with a rock seems unnecessarily cruel to me), killing my food would be something better done well in advance of mealtime, not once I've sat at the table.

In general, though, I don't think that I'd have an issue killing my own food. That's hypothetical, of course, since (outside of fishing) I've never had to do that.

Re: Beyond Meat S-1

#414

Post by JohnFen »

int_19h wrote: post #211
rubicon33 wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been following this thread and it's gotten me curious. I can't help but wonder - do you have some kind of personal connection to this farmer? How does one source a farmer, let alone one that is willing to let you meet the cow, be there on slaughter day, etc. These are all things that are foreign to most people.

Just googling around, it seems that you can find quite a few farmers advertising such services. For a more personal connection, I'd start at the local farmers' market.

> For a more personal connection, I'd start at the local farmers' market.

I agree. The farmer's market was my entryway. At ours, local ranchers are present and selling their meats. There is a huge wealth of knowledge about what exists in your area at a farmer's market. Not just for meat, but for everything.

Re: Beyond Meat S-1

#415

Post by JohnFen »

Consultant32452 wrote: post #343
cthalupa wrote: post #315

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep. I've killed several smaller animals and processed them, etc. Not a huge deal to me. I've yet to kill or process a whole cow, though I've broken down primals/subprimals. I'm not sure how I would do if it was an animal I had raised. If I'm a farmer or rancher with a few dozen or hundreds of heads of cattle, probably no different. If it was a single cow... I might have trouble. Everyone is different, though. Even s…

I don't mean this as an insult, because I think I would be the same way. I think what you described is a very privileged position of someone who has likely never felt real hunger. I acknowledge I might have the same feelings you describe about raising a single animal for food. Particularly for species that are more emotive. But that's because I too have a historically unfathomable variety of options and privilege.

> I think what you described is a very privileged position of someone who has likely never felt real hunger.

I think that's an excellent point. I suspect that nearly everyone, if faced with actual starvation, would be able to kill their own food.

Re: Beyond Meat S-1

#416

Post by stjohnswarts »

I remain a keto advocate but I can understand why vegetarians do what they do and kudos to them for choosing to do it. However, if I have to listen to one more skinny white girl angrily try to convince me that I'm evil because I'm not vegan/vegetarian I might crack and yell back.

Re: Beyond Meat S-1

#417

Post by stjohnswarts »

sammycdubs wrote: post #158

I've seen this said before (I forget from who), but I honestly think that over the next few decades meat is going to go through a similar transition to tobacco. I don't think it's ever going to disappear completely, but I think it's going to become something most people only enjoy once in a while if at all. I also think that meat consumption is going to be viewed in a significantly more negative light over time.

Why would it go through the same transition as tobacco? There is absolutely nothing good about tobacco. Meat however is nutritious, delicious, and healthy. I do agree with vegans that it is resource intensive compared with veggies. I will be happy to consume lab grown meat or veggie based meats as long as they don't have dangerous carbs and still taste as good as the original.

Re: Beyond Meat S-1

#418

Post by stjohnswarts »

nostalgiac wrote: post #339
basetop wrote: post #304

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Meat consumption is expected to increase as less developed nations like china, india, ASEAN countries, africa get wealthier. https://ourworldindata.org/meat-and-seafood-production-consu... People forget that for much of the 3rd world, meat was an unaffordable luxury. It won't be for much longer as they develop. Also, meat is a natural part of a healthy human diet. It's unrealistic to think that meat consumption is go…

> Also, meat is a natural part of a healthy human diet. It's unrealistic to think that meat consumption is going to be viewed as tobacco. I disagree. https://www.who.int/features/qa/cancer-red-meat/en/

I disagree with you, there are far too many hands in the pot at WHO to take them with anything other than a grain of salt:

https://www.cancertodaymag.org/Pages/Winter2018-2019/Carb-Co...

Re: Beyond Meat S-1

#419

Post by somethoughts »

kabacha wrote: post #359
somethoughts wrote: post #11

I've always thought two things: - Subway should have leaned into their use of soy in their deli meat [1] and came in from the high end with it being the more expensive, high end, healthier, better for the environment product - There should be high end burger chain which give you an eighth of a pound real meat burger patty for taste reasons and an eighth of a pound vegetarian patty for health and environment reasons.…

> Asian means of eating tofu is fundamentally different from the vegitarian way of eating tofu. The Asian means of preparation is typically 75% tofu and 25% is meat for taste. Am from Asia and I've never heard and seen this in my life. Tofu is _never_ mixed with meat. That's a bit of an absurd statement as tofu and meat have nothing in common unless frozen and deepfried (then tofu has a texture of chicken).

Sorry - yes, I meant served with meat, not necessarily ground and blended together. I'm thinking Mapo Tofu (Chinese), Soondubu/Jjigae (Korean), Niku Tofu (Japanese).

Re: Beyond Meat S-1

#420

Post by iN7h33nD »

elhudy wrote: post #405
iN7h33nD wrote: post #355

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don't live a happy life being raped and having a child taken away at birth so that milk can be produced for humans. All animals cannot live "happy" lives. Demand won't allow it. There is no future where all animals can be happy and the level of meat consumption can stay the same. So you would choose to live a happy 15 years and then die. Unfortunately most animals that we farm cannot and do not live happy lives,…

>There is no future where all animals can be happy and the level of meat consumption can stay the same. I'm not in disagreement with this...just because you're cynical about the future of husbandry doesn't mean I can't be optimistic about it. I'm unsure how repeatedly stating facts about the worst of the current state of factory farming is going to change my mind about how we can potentially lessen demand and migrate…

How will a future where are animals that humans consume leading happy lives decrease demand? Doesn't decreasing demand counter your point about creating more lives being a better thing, since that would lead to less lives?

Even if I was optimistic about farming being able to have animals leading happy lives, it would still ignore many negative factors dealing with animal consumption:

1. The environmental impact from animal consumption would increase if all animals lead happy lives and consumption stayed the same.

2. Dairy products could no longer be produced as that would lead to unhappy animals

3. The sustainability of eating animals, we produce feed for them, and then we eat them. It would make much more sense to only produce feed for us.

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