Where do I opt out? As a EU citizen my rights are protected by GDPR yes?
The GDPR has a clause like "if not required by law". States are funny here: they operate the system and define the law.
EU votes to create gigantic biometrics database
181–190 of 203 posts
Re: EU votes to create gigantic biometrics database
#182I wonder how is this different than the US's system where even as a tourist I have to give them my biometrics so they can store it in their big database.
It's different because the EU is not a country. It's composed of countries which should have sovereignty over the data of their citizens. But now they'll have to give our biometrics away. Doesn't matter what individual countries say; this is the EU and there is no discussion to be had.
EU is composed of member states just like United States is composed of "united" states. The citizens of EU have equal rights.
There is hope the EU member states will get united one day as well but we are not there yet. Some want to have the cake and eat it too(i.e intelligence sharing but no data sharing, sovereignty and equal rights as well).
Currently the trend is to blame EU for anything like the EU would be an institution lead by states outside of the EU.
Re: EU votes to create gigantic biometrics database
#183Earlier quoted context omitted.
This misses the point. You could also say that monetary union between the US states makes no sense economically. The point is that the people decided to have a political union and to belong to the same country, the USA. Monetary union follows. The aim is to have a federal union in Europe. In a way, going straight to monetary union is to 'force' further political union because they know full well that it requires it i…
> The aim is to have a federal union in Europe. In a way, going straight to monetary union is to 'force' further political union because they know full well that it requires it in order to work. Sorry, but I disagree. There is no consensus whatsoever in the EU about a federal Union. There is not even consensus on a budgetary union (as in shared debt, not just having a shared currency) because it will reflect badly on…
> every time there was a popular referendum even the EU Constitution has been rejected by the population
That it was "rejected by the population" is a dishonest characterization. Referendums in Luxembourg and Spain were successful. Elected representatives in 16 other EU countries voted in favor of the Constitution. Yes, it was rejected by voters France and the Netherlands, and that killed the treaty, because establishing a Constitution requires unanimous support.
So, no, it wasn't rejected by "the population" (a term that it was always be inaccurate[1]). It was rejected by a minority. And the treaty being one that requires unanimous approval, failed because of that.
This Wikipedia page shows the full picture: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_establishing_a_Constitu...
[1] Anytime there's a characterization in the form of "the people" (or "the American people") it's dishonest and inaccurate, because the "people" of any large enough group hold diverse-enough opinions that you simply cannot characterize them with a broad brush. (Unless of course, you conduct referendum in which the question is affirmed unanimously by everyone in the group with a 100% quorum. Which gets quickly almost-impossible as the group's size increases.)
Re: EU votes to create gigantic biometrics database
#184Earlier quoted context omitted.
The big mistake the EU made was assuming: (i) that monetary union would foster political union, and (ii) the people of Europe actually wanted political union in the first place. I don't think either are true. I think we more or less agree with each other, by the way. It's important that the political situation matches the economic situation. I just don't think you can use the economics to force the politics, if you s…
Monetary union will lead to deeper political union. There is no choice. It already has.
This is not the view of Ashoka Mody in his recent book Eurotragedy.
Re: EU votes to create gigantic biometrics database
#185borders are legitimized racism it's fine if my country has certain policies that are different than your country. BUT LET INDIVIDUALS DECIDE WHICH SIDE THEY WANT TO BE ON. NOBODY CHOSE WHERE TO BE BORN
I would formalize it differently. Borders are established by a society of people who live in it. Historically, often based on racial, linguisitic or cultural differences. There is no right to any outsider to declare himself member of a society (just think of your book reading club). It is the right of the society to define the rationale for its membership. Is it unfair to many people to live in worse conditions: yes.…
well first of all i think you are equating society and territory, but even so, a society/territory is not akin to a book club. if there is only one club, that you are born into, does that analogy still make sense?
if "outsiders" have no right to declare themselves members of a society -- by what principle does the society earn this right?
it seems that this principle is merely the georgraphy beneath your feet when you were born. i can think of many alternative "rationales for membership" that are much less trivial. remember modern states were born out of "patriotism". i think that is still what defends them. the insider/outsider distinction is precisely the problem.
Re: EU votes to create gigantic biometrics database
#186Earlier quoted context omitted.
Monetary union will lead to deeper political union. There is no choice. It already has.
This is not the view of Ashoka Mody in his recent book Eurotragedy.
The fact is that the monetary union has brought closer political integration and will continue to do so because, again, that's the only way.
I think you're trying to ascribe more meaning to whatever book you've dropped the title of that it might have... (I haven't read that book but the author seems serious enough not to ignore facts)
Re: EU votes to create gigantic biometrics database
#187Earlier quoted context omitted.
This is not the view of Ashoka Mody in his recent book Eurotragedy.
The fact is that the monetary union has brought closer political integration and will continue to do so because, again, that's the only way. I think you're trying to ascribe more meaning to whatever book you've dropped the title of that it might have... (I haven't read that book but the author seems serious enough not to ignore facts)
I may be mistaken but it looks like you haven’t read the book but you’re confident in assuming I’ve somehow misunderstood it!
Here’s the relevant quote in full:
“British economist Nicholas Kaldor had warned as early as March 1971 that the fiscal governance system would deepen political divisions. In November 1997, Milton Friedman predicted that the euro’s flawed economics would “exacerbate political tensions by converting divergent shocks ... into divisive political issues.” The Europeans had it backward, Friedman concluded: “Political unity can pave the way for monetary unity. Monetary union imposed under unfavourable circumstances will prove a barrier to the achievement of political unity.””
Re: EU votes to create gigantic biometrics database
#188Earlier quoted context omitted.
This is not the view of Ashoka Mody in his recent book Eurotragedy.
The fact is that the monetary union has brought closer political integration and will continue to do so because, again, that's the only way. I think you're trying to ascribe more meaning to whatever book you've dropped the title of that it might have... (I haven't read that book but the author seems serious enough not to ignore facts)
> The fact is that the monetary union has brought closer political integration and will continue to do so because, again, that's the only way.
there's another alternative: the entire thing self-destructs
which seems more likely at this point than full fiscal and political union
Re: EU votes to create gigantic biometrics database
#189Earlier quoted context omitted.
> The aim is to have a federal union in Europe. In a way, going straight to monetary union is to 'force' further political union because they know full well that it requires it in order to work. Sorry, but I disagree. There is no consensus whatsoever in the EU about a federal Union. There is not even consensus on a budgetary union (as in shared debt, not just having a shared currency) because it will reflect badly on…
> every time there was a popular referendum even the EU Constitution has been rejected by the population That it was "rejected by the population" is a dishonest characterization. Referendums in Luxembourg and Spain were successful. Elected representatives in 16 other EU countries voted in favor of the Constitution. Yes, it was rejected by voters France and the Netherlands, and that killed the treaty, because establis…
> So, no, it wasn't rejected by "the population" (a term that it was always be inaccurate[1]). It was rejected by a minority. And the treaty being one that requires unanimous approval, failed because of that.
Uhm sorry no. Read the links. It was rejected by the majority of the voters both in France and the Netherlands.
What happened afterwards in France was to change it slightly and make it pass by parliamentary vote instead.
About the accuracy of the term "the population", I simply mean it "by the local rules for a nation wide referendum".
Re: EU votes to create gigantic biometrics database
#190Earlier quoted context omitted.
The fact is that the monetary union has brought closer political integration and will continue to do so because, again, that's the only way. I think you're trying to ascribe more meaning to whatever book you've dropped the title of that it might have... (I haven't read that book but the author seems serious enough not to ignore facts)
I may be mistaken but it looks like you haven’t read the book but you’re confident in assuming I’ve somehow misunderstood it! Here’s the relevant quote in full: “British economist Nicholas Kaldor had warned as early as March 1971 that the fiscal governance system would deepen political divisions. In November 1997, Milton Friedman predicted that the euro’s flawed economics would “exacerbate political tensions by conve…
I'm stating facts. You're trying to find more and more random quotes in an attempt to prove your point... But you haven't found one yet.
Last time: The monetary union has led to closer political union and that can only continue.
Downvoting all of someone else's comments in a thread is immature and certainly rather poor when you're claiming to be running an educational website...