People Lose Their Employer-Sponsored Insurance Constantly • Hacker News Board

Re: People Lose Their Employer-Sponsored Insurance Constantly

#31

Post by benatkin » Wed, Apr 17, 2019, 5:20 PM UTC

dv_dt wrote: post #26

benatkin wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s been ameliorated somewhat by ACA and is the only reason I think it’s an improvement even though my premiums have gone up. There’s all sorts of pre-existing conditions, and healthcare with the threat of retroactive recision if they feel your application was incomplete ought to feel insecure to just about anyone.

Somewhat, but people with insurance are still the largest group of people with medical bankruptcies.

I don't mean that it's affordable, I just mean that the reason isn't a pre-existing condition exclusion. For insurance for myself I'm paying $484.71 a month and there's a $5850 deductible, after which it probably only covers some percentage of it, until a maximum out of pocket is reached (this information isn't viewable in my account online and is probably in some mail that I've thrown out). Certainly not affordable.

A pre-existing condition exclusion means that you're on your own for expenses arising from your pre-existing condition, or if you didn't report it when you applied for your health insurance, that you could have your health insurance retroactively cancelled, and have to pay back any money you received. It's really bad, but since some healthcare expenses seem to have more than tripled in the last 10 years, it's often worse today. I'd much rather pay 100% of $800 than 50% of $3000.

Re: People Lose Their Employer-Sponsored Insurance Constantly

#32

Post by usermac » Wed, Apr 17, 2019, 5:21 PM UTC

Healthcare finance is a mess in the US.

Re: People Lose Their Employer-Sponsored Insurance Constantly

#33

Post by gwbas1c » Wed, Apr 17, 2019, 5:22 PM UTC

terryschiavo22 wrote: post #2

Yes, people do lose their insurance constantly when they switch jobs...and then immediately sign onto their new plan. Is the argument that switching insurance plans is stressful? What's stressful is remaining uncovered. Switching plans is hardly comparable to the transition to a Medicare-for-all program.

I don't understand why you're downvoted. It's an important observation.

In my case, my employer was bought and sold 3 times. All three cases involved a sudden and abrupt termination of my insurance.

It was "okay" when I was single, but once I carried my wife, and then my entire family, it became a huge problem.

Throughout my tenure at my job, I had major surgery and two children. Sudden insurance changes immediately before or during any of those events would be a huge problem. (Fortunately, the timing worked out.)

Re: People Lose Their Employer-Sponsored Insurance Constantly

#34

Post by fwip » Wed, Apr 17, 2019, 5:23 PM UTC

midnightmonster wrote: post #8

terryschiavo22 wrote: post #2

Yes, people do lose their insurance constantly when they switch jobs...and then immediately sign onto their new plan. Is the argument that switching insurance plans is stressful? What's stressful is remaining uncovered. Switching plans is hardly comparable to the transition to a Medicare-for-all program.

They lose their insurance for other reasons, too. Their employer changes plans; they get dropped from full time to part time; they lose their job and don't immediately get another. And switching insurance plans at almost any time can be very costly, even if you go straight to a new one, as all your deductibles and out-of-pocket limits get reset. And then you have to hit them again when the plan year starts again, alm…

My employer switched health insurers 3 years in a row. First because we became a new company (understandable), second because they thought they could get a better deal at another place (okay...), and thirdly reverting the 2nd change except some of the numbers and coverage is different now.

I really am considering leaving if they switch a 4th time.

Re: People Lose Their Employer-Sponsored Insurance Constantly

#35

Post by maxxxxx » Wed, Apr 17, 2019, 5:24 PM UTC

gorbachev wrote: post #10

aNoob7000 wrote: post #5

Health insurance in the United States is a shit show. The Medicare for all that Bernie is proposing is a reaction to the inability of Congress to meaningfully fix the issue. I personally would prefer a market based approach to fixing the issues with obtaining medical care, but Congress can't do anything because there's just too much money and influence involved.

The insurance companies have had years (decades?) to come up with one. Instead they've invested in lobbying to keep the status quo.

All the inefficiencies are either profit or jobs for them. US health insurance companies are the worst bureaucracies I have ever seen. They have power over people's lives and almost zero accountability. They can do pretty much whatever they want and you are helpless if you can't afford the time and money to constantly call them or hire lawyers.

Re: People Lose Their Employer-Sponsored Insurance Constantly

#36

Post by luckydata » Wed, Apr 17, 2019, 5:25 PM UTC

aNoob7000 wrote: post #5

Health insurance in the United States is a shit show. The Medicare for all that Bernie is proposing is a reaction to the inability of Congress to meaningfully fix the issue. I personally would prefer a market based approach to fixing the issues with obtaining medical care, but Congress can't do anything because there's just too much money and influence involved.

There's no market based approach that can "fix" healthcare. Market self regulates around substitute goods, but healthcare is in the business of health and there's no substitute for that. Very few humans will say "all considered, the ROI/statistical likelhood of this procedure is not positive so I will pick death instead", it just doesn't happen. Single payer is the only way to go.

Re: People Lose Their Employer-Sponsored Insurance Constantly

#37

Post by helen___keller » Wed, Apr 17, 2019, 5:27 PM UTC

The point of health insurance is to pay into a risk pool as a collective so that the small percentage of people who end up needing the largest percentage of health care, nobody dies or goes into monumental debt. This can be done via taxes but insurance is a private market solution which should in theory make it more efficient for the sake of maximizing profit.

So then if it's supposedly more efficient, why do I waste multiple hours dealing with insurance bullshit literally every few months?

Start a new job at a startup, need to go to trainings to understand the health care options and choose one, get new cards and website logins, update my info at every provider

New dentist is having difficulty getting my routine care billed to insurance and calls me every week asking for my insurance information again.

Wifes doctor didn't do something correctly when I updated insurance so now I need to call and deal with this big medical bill that I shouldn't have gotten.

Startup got acquired so I get another training for the new insurance options. And get new cards and logins and update with all providers again

Planning to get a surgical operation but nobody can tell me how much it will cost, doctor says "probably whatever your deductible is" except I have a high deductible plan so is it really going to cost me $2500?

Etc cetera. There's no end to the nuisance. If I could choose to just pay more in taxes (hell I'll pay way more than my current premiums) and never deal with insurance again, I would do it in a heartbeat.

Re: People Lose Their Employer-Sponsored Insurance Constantly

#38

Post by akhilcacharya » Wed, Apr 17, 2019, 5:27 PM UTC

dv_dt wrote: post #20

bluejekyll wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The Medicare for all that Bernie is proposing is a reaction to the inability of Congress to meaningfully fix the issue. Wouldn't expanding Medicare to all also require an act of Congress? Bernie will have the influence of the White House, which is important, but it doesn't change the fact that Congress is still the body that would need to fix this. I've always felt like the Affordable Care Act was a bandaid almost…

After Obama ran on hope and change and won, one thing he did was shut down his very capable campaign organization without transitioning it to something else. It was maybe one tactical reason that later midterms became a mess for Democrats. It's pretty clear the Bernie's organization, as well as the loose independent collective of progressive organizations around similar national and local causes who have also sprung…

> as well as the loose independent collective of progressive organizations around similar national and local causes who have also sprung up,

The problem being that none of their candidates won competitive seats. Now, some like Kara Eastman came close..but candidates closer to the Obama/Hillary mold, veterans, and pro-gun control candidates in suburbs made up the bulk of the wins in the midterms.

Re: People Lose Their Employer-Sponsored Insurance Constantly

#39

Post by TheSoftwareGuy » Wed, Apr 17, 2019, 5:28 PM UTC

guitarbill wrote: post #23

jwildeboer wrote: post #9

People [in the US] … ;)

As much as your comment might be taken in the wrong way, it is important to point out first world countries have this sorted. I simply don't get it. When did patriotism become about military might and waving flags instead of making sure your fellow countrymen don't live in agony, fear, and poverty?

I'd say about 1946, or whenever the cold war is said to have officially begun. Or maybe even earlier during WW2.

That being said the sentiment was never a good one, and we do need to move on from it.

Re: People Lose Their Employer-Sponsored Insurance Constantly

#40

Post by aantix » Wed, Apr 17, 2019, 5:28 PM UTC

dv_dt wrote: post #25

davidw wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Italy has a thriving market based private health care industry. You can call in and get prices and everything. Just that it's in addition to the single payer system, which means the private one is cheap because the competition is 'free'. As a % of GDP, Italy spends a lot less than the US in health care, and people live long and productive lives. I mention Italy because 1) I lived there and 2) it's not some perfectly…

All other first world nations pay less. On average they pay less than half what the US pays. The fully socialized systems, like the UK, seem to trend lower in cost, as low as one third the cost of the US. But really, the takeaway should be you need universal healthcare with significant government cost controls on drugs and procedures, after that almost any arrangement of public/private administration works (but the c…

Without the U.S. subsidizing the drug research R&D, who pays for it?

You could fill notebooks with worthy, approachable hypotheses for any number of diseases that could show promise if given the funding.

But if everyone makes it law to cap prices - fewer scientists, labs, studies are performed.

The money has to come from somewhere.

I think countries take for granted the progress we've made. No progress is made without incredible intellectual efforts and monetary backings.