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Americans Are Delaying Health Care Until Tax Refunds Arrive

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Re: Americans Are Delaying Health Care Until Tax Refunds Arrive

#151

Post by mattigames »

peteradio wrote: post #109
bryan11 wrote: post #102

As employers switch to High Deductible Health Plans where insurance doesn't kick in until one has spent a deductible of several thousand dollars, many people are delaying health care in general. A doctor's visit that once cost a co-pay of $30 is now frequently a cash price from $130 to $400, plus more for lab work. With higher costs and much of them unknown in advance, many skip getting things checked until it seems…

I paid 400 dollars to have a doctor tell me to neti pot my nose after having sinus infection for 3 months. Might not be rational but fuck everything about this system. Who is pocketing all this goddamn money?

Does it matter who? They charge you because they can, America decided your survival (AKA health) is just another business an you can be charged as much as you are willing to pay for it; and those companies -with the help of cultural baggage- have convinced a significant chunk of the population that this shady business is part of the "freedoms" you have as American, because controlling the prices would be "communism" or "socialism", words we all were taught to associate with evilness and enemies.

Re: Americans Are Delaying Health Care Until Tax Refunds Arrive

#152

Post by toasterlovin »

shams93 wrote: post #77
kartan wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That tax withholding is the only way that many Americans manage to save speaks more to a lack of self-control than anything else. I understand that it may seem so. But, when there is millions of Americans in that situation then it is a systemic problem not a personal one. There is a lot of on-line resources about this topic. e.g. https://www.google.com/search?q=the+cost+of+being+poor

Yeah there was a great breakdown of this when the representative from Irvine, California grilled CEO Jaimie Dimon, a bank teller who lives in Irvine makes $15 an hour, basically such a person if they have their own apartment will be forced to choose between having food and having a phone. We have kept salaries frozen for so many decades that we have impoverished the majority of working people to a ridiculous level. A…

It’s rich that the representative from Irvine thinks hourly pay is the problem and not the cost of housing in CA. I am in the 96th percentile of earners and there is no way my family could afford to live in Irvine.

Re: Americans Are Delaying Health Care Until Tax Refunds Arrive

#153

Post by astura »

usaar333 wrote: post #136
burlesona wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not necessarily that simple. I would say that for most Americans who are cash poor, they intentionally do not optimize their taxes to break even, but rather to ensure they never end up owing the government money at the end of the year. The rationale for this is pretty simple. Even if you're poor, $50 a month in extra income isn't going to make or break you, but an unexpected bill for $600 in April can really mes…

It is still better to save an extra $50 in your own bank account than let the government pay you 0% interest in it.

Not if you'd otherwise spend the extra $50 each month.

Re: Americans Are Delaying Health Care Until Tax Refunds Arrive

#154

Post by tapland »

0n0n0m0uz wrote: post #115

Would you pay a few % more in taxes knowing that every human in this nation could receive the healthcare they need? I would without a second thought.

With single payer you could possibly expect a tax-reduction for the same care.

You guys pay top 3 in the world in taxes towards healthcare, and just as much out of pocket, making it almost 2x as expensive for individuals than for example the nordic countries.

As a comparison 1 year max coverage for all visits and procedures after which you pay $0 is about $125 and another $125 for meds in the nordics. That's with the same $ amount of taxes per capita to healthcare.

Re: Americans Are Delaying Health Care Until Tax Refunds Arrive

#155

Post by Spooky23 »

apta wrote: post #110
Spooky23 wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Usurious loans are unethical and disgusting. If people aren’t capable of effective money management, that just reinforces that the justifications used by that agency are bunk.

Practically all owns today are usurious, since interest is involved. If you look at the old testament and the Quran, this was prohibited for a reason, and we see the effects today very clearly.

Living in 2019, I’m not referring to the medieval context of the word.

Re: Americans Are Delaying Health Care Until Tax Refunds Arrive

#156

Post by learc83 »

mgkimsal wrote: post #120
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> High Deductible Health Plans where insurance doesn't kick in until one has spent a deductible of several thousand dollars HDHPs are a great deal for anyone who can set aside the deductible’s value in cash. They are a bad default. But a good thing to consider if you can set aside some cash. (The problem with HSA-compatible plans is they have a maximum deductible. They’re thus almost as expensive as non-HDHP plans.)

why is it a problem to have a maximum deductible? Relatedly, it seems like there's roughly some 'max' insurance expects you to pay each year, and you can decide whether to take the risk using a high deductible plan, and potentially not have many expenses, but lower premium, or have higher premium up front. 8 years ago, our HDHP was ... $280/month. It's now north of $800, and the deductible went up. Yes, we're a bit o…

8 years ago insurance was allowed to have yearly and lifetime policy limits. They could deny coverage for preexisting conditions and increase your premiums if you developed new conditions. You were also 8 years younger, which makes a big difference despite being only a few years.

Many people had policies with $100k yearly limits, any serious condition and they basically didn't have insurance.

Re: Americans Are Delaying Health Care Until Tax Refunds Arrive

#157

Post by harimau777 »

anbop wrote: post #146
epncs wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having a full time job and not being able to afford to have your own place is simply miserable.

That’s an absurd level of luxury that people have become accommodated to. To the nearest percentage point, 0% of people in human history have grown up with the expectation of an entire dwelling as their personal domain. It’s wasteful and absurd. Resources like showers which are used 15 minutes a day should not sit idly all day waiting for a single person.

While certain facilities may have been shared, my understanding is that generally speaking people have been able to have a space that they or at least their family owned. Personally, I would be thrilled to own the place I live even if things like bathrooms were shared.

Re: Americans Are Delaying Health Care Until Tax Refunds Arrive

#158

Post by toasterlovin »

harimau777 wrote: post #145
anbop wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would you expect that a bank teller has their own apartment? Your own apartment isn’t some kind of birthright. I had roommates until I was 27.

I disagree. Throughout most of human history families have been able to own their own home . If someone was unable to own their own home they were free to establish a homestead on some unclaimed land. I conclude that the ability to own your own home is part of the social contract. I realize that in many cases the land was technically owned by the gentry but I am talking about the day to day reality.

Throughout most of North American history post-Columbus, sure. The rest of history was what we developed world moderns would call grinding poverty for most people at most times. And the only reason peasants had land (when they did actually own land) is because it was their source of sustenance. It wasn’t the place for idleness that land is for most people in the developed world.

Re: Americans Are Delaying Health Care Until Tax Refunds Arrive

#159

Post by whoopdedo »

toasterlovin wrote: post #152
shams93 wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah there was a great breakdown of this when the representative from Irvine, California grilled CEO Jaimie Dimon, a bank teller who lives in Irvine makes $15 an hour, basically such a person if they have their own apartment will be forced to choose between having food and having a phone. We have kept salaries frozen for so many decades that we have impoverished the majority of working people to a ridiculous level. A…

It’s rich that the representative from Irvine thinks hourly pay is the problem and not the cost of housing in CA. I am in the 96th percentile of earners and there is no way my family could afford to live in Irvine.

Housing cost is a problem in California (and New York, and D.C.). But wage stagnation is a problem everywhere. That rents are too high in Irvine doesn't negate the fact that wages are too low as well.

Re: Americans Are Delaying Health Care Until Tax Refunds Arrive

#160

Post by toasterlovin »

toast0 wrote: post #84
xiphias2 wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually both. It was crazy when I read from a person that he preferred paying his rent over eating, but it actually makes sense: if you get to the street, and not able to clean yourself, the chances of getting a job goes down dramatically.

If you get evicted, you're going to have a lot harder time getting into another apartment, too. It's also a lot easier to get help with food than to get help with a place to live.

Also food is insanely inexpensive. Doesn’t come anywhere near cost of housing unless you have a large family.
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