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Making Video Games Is Not a Dream Job

nytimes.com

411–420 of 505 posts

Re: Making Video Games Is Not a Dream Job

#411
post #8

It is a dream job if I’m my own boss.

Want to be? go for it. Cost of entry for macOS/iOS/tvOS is ~$1000 for total basic development & distribution hard costs on par with AAA studios; to wit a refurbished MacBook Air, Xcode, and Developer registration gives objective core tools to go from blank project to worldwide distribution. (Detail, talent, and advertising extra.) YMMV for other platforms.

Time is the significant cost. Everything you mentioned is trivial. Unpredictable returns is another important factor.

I've made profitable games previously.

Re: Making Video Games Is Not a Dream Job

#412
post #365

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> People spend countless hours working on open source software for free just because they like it. Some people create or contribute as part of their job. If the job requires new software, the company doesn't want to sell the software, and the developer thinks others could use it, then why not open source?

Because open sourcing that code is taking work away from future software developers. The second company which needs that software would otherwise have to pay employees to build it or purchase it from third party software developers. The person open sourcing the software is therefore lowering the global demand for software developers which hurts the wages of all software developers. For the record, I don't think this…

I beleive that open source software creates fiercer competition and helps newcomers, thus in general increases wages for software developers.

Re: Making Video Games Is Not a Dream Job

#413
post #403
post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the only practical solution is for people to stop taking on terrible jobs because of some sense of 'passion' So the “practical” solution is to change human nature? That doesn’t sound right. It’d be like saying that the practical solution to human trafficking is for people to stop visiting prostitutes; or that the solution to gangs’ drug income is for people to stop buying drugs. In all these cases, you can quash su…

I'd say a better solution would be to universal income, or a freedom fund of sorts. So people can be free to go and do their passion jobs, be it making music or writing games. Game development companies might become more like a collective where the developers who are all on universal income pool together and treated as equals. One can dream.

I’m interested why the dreamer was downvoted.

Re: Making Video Games Is Not a Dream Job

#414
post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the only practical solution is for people to stop taking on terrible jobs because of some sense of 'passion' So the “practical” solution is to change human nature? That doesn’t sound right. It’d be like saying that the practical solution to human trafficking is for people to stop visiting prostitutes; or that the solution to gangs’ drug income is for people to stop buying drugs. In all these cases, you can quash su…

>IT'd be like saying that the practical solution to human trafficking is for people to stop visiting prostitutes I don't want to nitpick but a lot of the strategy surrounding ending human trafficking involves cutting off demand, which means trying to stop johns from buying prostitutes. This sort of `cut off the demand` strategy isn't entirely unheard of.

That is a common strategy but, as far as I can tell, a completely useless one. The US govt has been spending resources for years pushing messages that people should just not do drugs, or that by doing drugs they are funding terrorists, destroying families, etc. I haven't seen any evidence that such campaigns work, and given drug use rates across time and countries I'm pretty skeptical that they do.

Re: Making Video Games Is Not a Dream Job

#415

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course you can stop being exploited as a game developer by leaving the games industry---but why should people be forced to change their career in order to avoid exploitation?

It is also worth noting that many of the skills in the games industry are highly specialized to the games industry. Games is kind of like a 'galapagos island' to its own. Most games developers won't know any language other than C++, won't know anything about the web, won't know anything about databases, etc....

C++ is consistently one of the most popular programming languages [0].

Large-project, high-performance C++ programming that a game developer likely possesses is probably one of the most broadly portable programming skills a person could have.

[0] https://www.tiobe.com/tiobe-index/cplusplus/

Re: Making Video Games Is Not a Dream Job

#416

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And the type of software people make for free is not the same software people get paid to create. I bet few people would be eager to develop banking software on their free time for instance.

There's a lot more overlap than I'd have predicted 30 years ago. There are very good open source databases, content management systems, web servers, full text corpus search systems, operating systems, and 100s of other "kind of boring" things that a 20 year old version of me would assume people would need to be paid to create. (Some of those are a crossover where a substantial portion of the development was originall…

They are often paid to create these things, by their employers. They then open source them to in the hope of getting free engineering resources from other companies that care about the same thing.

Re: Making Video Games Is Not a Dream Job

#417
post #31

> For many kids who grew up with controllers in their hands, being a game developer is a dream job, so when it comes to talent, supply is higher than demand. That's the crux of this entire article in one sentence. This might be an upopular opinion here, but right now the supply of developers overall [across all industries] is much lower than demand. No one is forcing a developer to work for a game studio. It might be…

Game development is more than just programming.

Re: Making Video Games Is Not a Dream Job

#418
post #329

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you _really_ think your photography job deserves the same hourly wage as an engineer or manager?

What quality freelance developer or manager in the US takes 4 hour jobs for even close to $25 per hour, in a customer choosen location?

Programming is just glorified copy and paste, so it has more in common with photography than you think.

Re: Making Video Games Is Not a Dream Job

#419
post #97

> For many kids who grew up with controllers in their hands, being a game developer is a dream job, so when it comes to talent, supply is higher than demand This is basically the reason for low wages in quite a few 'passion' driven industries. If a job is something enough people want to do, then talent is cheap and plentiful and companies can provide low wages and poor conditions that for every person who quits, ten…

For an example of unionization and certification issues that deal with this, look at the medical field. There are many more people that want to be doctors than there are spots in med schools (US-centric view point here). The AMA artificially keeps the enrollment numbers at med-schools low, so as to drive demand for doctors in general and therefore, increase their wages. The AMA is well aware of the current shortage o…

IAAD. Most of these points on medicine are either outdated or plain inaccurate. 1. The AMA had tight control on med schools 50-100 years ago. These days a mediocre score on the MCAT and a desire for $300k+ in debt will get you into a for-profit medical school. More DOs match with MDs, there are more foreign IMGs, and even US med school slots have grown in the past 10 years. The (over)supply of med students is a non-issue in 2019 except for the aforementioned bag holders that really had no business in med school.

2. Since the 60s the AMA continues a slow decline in relevance. Less than 25% of MDs in the US are AMA members. I was an AMA member. Why? Because they bribed me and my classmates with significant discounts on exam prep material. At some point there will be more student members than practicing physicians.

3. The AMA may be aware of pediatricians vs. cardiologists, but they have little to do with it now. One, the over-abundance of cardiologists isn't an indisputable fact. Regional maldistribution is a thing. There are many parts of the US where a cards referral will still take months. The AMA is not the reason pediatric specialities have relatively poor compensation relative to years of training and lifestyle. The ACGME and other interest groups, even big pharma, device manufacturers had much to do with setting the stage. These days, large organizations help maintain the status quo.

Consider that pediatric subspecialties are not competitive. Just about any average to slightly below average US grad that wants to do it can... it's not a labor supply issue!

In 2019 some doctors have it pretty good, and some not so much. Geographic disparities are huge. The public policy affecting medical practitioners is now a large number of independent special interest groups and public policy wonks. For instance, cardiologists have the ACC (their own body), but what is really powerful at this point is the motley group of pharma companies and interventional device mfrs, and huge HCOs... practitioners can benefit because obviously some interests align (A TAVR isn't too profitable without a doc to place it).

tl;dr medical professionals sort of bounce around in a Medusa head of healthcare organization and industry special interests these days... we're doing well insofar as we are useful idiots in this machine. The idea that we have unified representation is laughable.

Re: Making Video Games Is Not a Dream Job

#420

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And they're also free to, rather than leave their dream career, push for unionization instead and fight to remain inside it. Just leaving is one choice, but fighting is another.

Sure, they are free to do that. I mostly take issue with the framing by the NYT, talking of "exploitation" and unionization as the only choice/way to fight back. Especially the "exploitation" bit - game developers are not slaves, by a long stretch. If work conditions are bad, it is because many people fancy their job over the alternatives. You could also "fight" by creating your own game studio with better work condi…

> If work conditions are bad, it is because many people fancy their job over the alternatives.

What lol? No, working conditions are bad due to deadlines and management being unwilling to hire more people / move deadlines / cut scope / etc.

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