Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

1969 and 1970 at Bell Labs

larryluckham.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

71–80 of 83 posts

Re: 1969 and 1970 at Bell Labs

#71

Post by ghaff »

RcouF1uZ4gsC wrote: post #27

One of the things I notice is that there is not a single Asian male in any of the photos. If you went into any software office around Oakland, CA or the larger Bay Area now, I would guess that 30-50% (if not more) of the programmers you see would be Asian males.

I worked for a computer company in the Boston area in the late 80s/90s and there were a minuscule number of Asians. We did some support work for legacy products in India through a partner and had a Japanese subsidiary but it was a rarity for any people from those orgs to be located in the US.

Re: 1969 and 1970 at Bell Labs

#72

Post by bregma »

mpweiher wrote: post #63
fmajid wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well into the 90s one of my aunts was a programmer on the 5ESS switch code, mission-critical stuff that needed to be 99.9995% reliable. She was eventually laid off when Lucent abandoned the line and she transitioned into a far more lucrative career as a realtor. I know other ladies of my mother's generation (I was born in 1970) who worked at IBM and the like. If you look at female percentage of enrollment in CS cours…

> in part because PCs were aggressively marketed towards boys only. I've seen this repeated a lot without, as far as I can see, any credible evidence that (a) this was actually the case and (b) that the causality worked the way indicated. To me, it's at best a classic "wet roads cause rain" fallacy that doesn't make sense at any level. 1. Companies are dollar driven This idea that companies would forego a massive mar…

> Although I don't remember much in terms of ads, what I remember was fairly neutral. As a quick check, I did a Google image search and the ads were quite balanced, for example families grouped around a computer with mom+dad+girl+boy.

Hoo boy, are you naive. I still have computer mags from the 1980s (and maybe I have a pack-rat problem, but that's not important now).

A awful lot of the hardware ads had buxom nubile while female models, sometimes draped over the machine, sometimes with a sultry expression (why are you biting your lip over a freakin' backup tape system, woman?), often with caked-on hooker makeup. The software ads almost always had some young white man with an IBM-approved white shirt and pocket protector.

Ads in popular computer mags in the 1980s were definitely target-marketed towards white male hetero people. To claim the advertizing was ineffective and such people "just wanted" the devices is disingenuous at best.

Re: 1969 and 1970 at Bell Labs

#73

Post by 0815test »

bregma wrote: post #72
mpweiher wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> in part because PCs were aggressively marketed towards boys only. I've seen this repeated a lot without, as far as I can see, any credible evidence that (a) this was actually the case and (b) that the causality worked the way indicated. To me, it's at best a classic "wet roads cause rain" fallacy that doesn't make sense at any level. 1. Companies are dollar driven This idea that companies would forego a massive mar…

> Although I don't remember much in terms of ads, what I remember was fairly neutral. As a quick check, I did a Google image search and the ads were quite balanced, for example families grouped around a computer with mom+dad+girl+boy. Hoo boy, are you naive. I still have computer mags from the 1980s (and maybe I have a pack-rat problem, but that's not important now). A awful lot of the hardware ads had buxom nubile w…

> why are you biting your lip over a freakin' backup tape system, woman?

Backup tape systems are sexy, man. That woman is a real geek!

Re: 1969 and 1970 at Bell Labs

#75

Post by major505 »

laumars wrote: post #55
peteradio wrote: post #25

All these comments on the number of women in the photographs and "what happened to all the women in tech?" ... I'm just thinking the photographer was a man with a plan. Anyway heres Wonderwall https://web.archive.org/web/20190202185041/http://www.larryl...

There may be a little bit of a selection bias going on - as you described - but it is worth remembering that back in the 50s and possibly 60s system administrators did used to be quite a female dominated role because they used to manage the cypher machines during the second world war while the men went off to fight and thus that trend of seeing women in server rooms continued a little while after. Sadly the designing…

And muuch of the time, men would work in more phisical jobs like factories, and construction, that where booming in this days, and where well paid jobs.

Re: 1969 and 1970 at Bell Labs

#77

Post by mpweiher »

bregma wrote: post #72
mpweiher wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> in part because PCs were aggressively marketed towards boys only. I've seen this repeated a lot without, as far as I can see, any credible evidence that (a) this was actually the case and (b) that the causality worked the way indicated. To me, it's at best a classic "wet roads cause rain" fallacy that doesn't make sense at any level. 1. Companies are dollar driven This idea that companies would forego a massive mar…

> Although I don't remember much in terms of ads, what I remember was fairly neutral. As a quick check, I did a Google image search and the ads were quite balanced, for example families grouped around a computer with mom+dad+girl+boy. Hoo boy, are you naive. I still have computer mags from the 1980s (and maybe I have a pack-rat problem, but that's not important now). A awful lot of the hardware ads had buxom nubile w…

> (why are you biting your lip over a freakin' backup tape system, woman?),

Hmm...and young boys are the target market for backup tape systems?

Maybe I should have been more specific: the context was home computers, not the professional systems. I thought that much was obvious.

And even there, do you seriously think that the motivation for those ads was "oh, we must make sure that women don't enter the profession" or was it more "we know that 95+% of our target audience is male" and so they used the same sort of tactics that were used to sell cars and auto tuning products[1]?

Again: wet roads do not cause rain.

[1] https://www.autobild.de/bilder/die-goldenen-jahre-von-d-w-83...

Re: 1969 and 1970 at Bell Labs

#78

Post by eatmyshorts »

newnewpdro wrote: post #41
Latteland wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It was the end of the 60s, people! My personal experience of that time was that my dad was in his heyday, he worked at IBM as an engineer. I remember seeing equipment like that in the early 70s when I visited him at work. People dressed in flamboyant clothes, had long hair, a lot more counter-cultural acceptance, in certain circles at least.

Yep, ~1969 seems like peak USA in a number of ways. Music, psychedelics, muscle cars / car styling in general, clothing, journalism, what else?

Lead in the air we breath. Coincides pretty much with muscle cars. Once they removed lead from gasoline, muscle cars withered for a few decades.

Indoor smoking.

Rampant discrimination, against ethnic minorities, women, and LGBTQ.

The "good ole days" generally aren't as good as we remember them.

Re: 1969 and 1970 at Bell Labs

#80

Post by salivation »

RcouF1uZ4gsC wrote: post #27

One of the things I notice is that there is not a single Asian male in any of the photos. If you went into any software office around Oakland, CA or the larger Bay Area now, I would guess that 30-50% (if not more) of the programmers you see would be Asian males.

Gee, no Indians either, so I guess we have to interpret that as unfair hiring practices.
Post reply on HN