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Ex-Mozilla CTO: I was grilled for three hours at US airport by border cops

theregister.co.uk

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Re: Ex-Mozilla CTO: I was grilled for three hours at US airport by border cops

#251

Post by xnyan »

teh_klev wrote: post #129
Diederich wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it a risk if you stay in the airport, in the secure zone? (Whatever it's called...I've flown rarely over the past couple of decades.)

Yes, on a flight to and from New Zealand with a refuel/crew change in LA I was fingerprinted, retina scanned and asked about my personal business despite being held in the "secure" zone. This was 2005 so they didn't have such a hard-on for electronic devices back then. Seeing as the US has upped its game quite a bit since then, the likelihood of me ever visiting the US is now zero. Sorry my fellow US HN'rs. And you k…

If you're not being hassled in EU airports, it's because they already have your information. Not whataboutism, but most EU states and all the powerful ones have active, conservative intelligence and police that work closely with the United States and give them any information they want. Stay safe.

It's not just 5 countries: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Five_Eyes

Re: Ex-Mozilla CTO: I was grilled for three hours at US airport by border cops

#252

Post by mikeash »

3487fm9so8g wrote: post #121
musha68k wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quick reminder: Non US citizens only go to conferences outside the US. There is no excuse we should put up with this. Canada and EU are much better locations for this reason alone.

[flagged]

What if I don’t support or defend the Second Amendment? Does that make me unamerican? Should I renounce my citizenship?

Re: Ex-Mozilla CTO: I was grilled for three hours at US airport by border cops

#253

Post by wang_li »

schoen wrote: post #208
Diederich wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I had no idea, thank you.

This is often called "sterile transit" (the ability to depart the airport without passing through immigration), and the U.S. and Mexico (and apparently Canada) don't allow this, while generally European and Asian countries do. https://wikitravel.org/en/Avoiding_a_transit_of_the_United_S...

I've had to go through security and immigration when flying through Dublin and Seoul. So I don't think you can exempt Europe and Asia from the list.

Re: Ex-Mozilla CTO: I was grilled for three hours at US airport by border cops

#255

Post by rchaud »

CalChris wrote: post #130

> Gal said the agents did take away his Global Entry pass, which allows express entry through customs, as punishment for not complying with their demands. I wonder about the legality of the CBP punitively confiscating his Global Entry pass.

In addition to that, I also wonder what punishments they can mete out to people who happen to not be high-level Apple employees with a network of powerful people who can advocate on his behalf.

Re: Ex-Mozilla CTO: I was grilled for three hours at US airport by border cops

#256

Post by duskhen »

TheRealPomax wrote: post #228
schoen wrote: post #208

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is often called "sterile transit" (the ability to depart the airport without passing through immigration), and the U.S. and Mexico (and apparently Canada) don't allow this, while generally European and Asian countries do. https://wikitravel.org/en/Avoiding_a_transit_of_the_United_S...

No EU airport allows this for flights from outside the EU/Schengen zone. Every international airport has dedicated "EU internal" and "all other" terminal pathways for this reason.

Yes, they do. Unless I misinterpreted your comment, connection flights from outside EU to US/Canada don’t require the Schengen visa as passengers don’t leave the “clean” zone.

Re: Ex-Mozilla CTO: I was grilled for three hours at US airport by border cops

#257

Post by txcwpalpha »

alex_hitchins wrote: post #18

The message it sends to me is, never visit America. I appreciate horrible things likely happen in my own country, but this is just disgusting.

I think you mean "never visit Anywhere", since the UK (where you say you're from) does this exact same type of search and seizure, even to UK citizens. You could be subject to it when returning home from any trip abroad, not just the US.

Re: Ex-Mozilla CTO: I was grilled for three hours at US airport by border cops

#258

Post by mikeash »

coldtea wrote: post #148
mikeash wrote: post #14

Quick reminder: US citizens have an absolute right to reenter the country. Customs can temporarily detain you, but they cannot refuse entry. Any threat, whether implied or stated, that they will hold you until you unlock your device is not real. They can hold your stuff indefinitely, so be prepared to lose it if you go this route, but never unlock your device based on the idea that it’s the only way to go free. Non-c…

> Any threat, whether implied or stated, that they will hold you until you unlock your device is not real Except the threat to put you on a "mess up with every time they fly" list.

I don’t understand why you’d quote me saying one type of threat isn’t real, then reply with “except...” and describe a totally different threat.

Re: Ex-Mozilla CTO: I was grilled for three hours at US airport by border cops

#259

Post by jandrese »

Zak wrote: post #171
everdrive wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I strongly suspect that CBP's "strong suspicion" is equivalent to a HN poster's "whim." I'm not insulting either party, however when anything similar to this debate plays out, parties talk past each other on this sort of disagreement.

"Reasonable suspicion" is a legal term. In this context, a CBP officer would need to have evidence that would lead a reasonable person to believe the item to be searched is illegal to bring into the country, or contains something that is illegal to bring into the country. A hunch is not sufficient; it requires objective evidence. Reasonable suspicion is not required for every search at a border crossing, and the Fede…

That only applies if the case goes to trial though. Border guards frequently assume that they have near unlimited power regardless of what the law says.

Re: Ex-Mozilla CTO: I was grilled for three hours at US airport by border cops

#260

Post by tombrossman »

metric10 wrote: post #168
wyldfire wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> but never unlock your device based on the idea that it’s the only way to go free. Best to enter the customs zone with the phone powered off, your device's security is likely better in this state, less likely to be circumvented while you surrender it.

Good advice! Things like mobile boarding passes and the "Mobile Passport" app encourage and train people to hand their devices over to TSA and CBP personnel. In that later case, unlocked and with an app CBP/DHS controls already installed (with a lengthy ToS no one ever reads).

On a related note, car rental places now email me the contract and rental documents by default, I receive no paperwork unless I remember to ask. The problem didn't register with me right away (It was so similar to what hotels do when you travel, all paperless now) but the last time I returned the car I asked them what I was supposed to do if I was stopped for a traffic violation. "You can open the email from us on your phone and give it to the officer" they suggested. I recommend everyone ask for a printed contract instead.

As an aside, on iOS, the airline apps I have used work like the Wallet app and are visible on the lock-screen, the device must be powered on but remains locked when you display your boarding pass, etc.

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