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A study of ethicists finds they’re no more ethical than the rest of us

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Re: A study of ethicists finds they’re no more ethical than the rest of us

#21

Post by AlexTWithBeard »

droithomme wrote: post #2

Thanks. There was a thread on HN yesterday about the benefits of a college education. There was a subthread arguing that without going to a formal college process of study of topics such as ethics and philosophy, a person could not hope to become a moral person, and therefore, the implication goes, college is not only necessary but fundamental to a moral society, and also obviously graduates are more moral and ethica…

a formal college process of study of topics such as ethics and philosophy

In the Soviet Union there was a mandatory college course in scientific communism. It was what it said on the box: studying of a scientific proof that communism is the next logical step of capitalism and the soon death of capitalism is inevitable.

The amount of hypocrisy was unbelievable and many skeptics were made this way.

Re: A study of ethicists finds they’re no more ethical than the rest of us

#22

Post by Judgmentality »

paultopia wrote: post #20

This is consistent with a few previous studies along the same lines, but also shouldn't be that surprising. Ethical knowledge or reasoning not only isn't sufficient for ethical behavior (weakness of will exists!), it might not even be necessary. It's easy to believe, e.g. with Hume (more or less) that we have a pretty good natural sense of right and wrong in day to day behavior. But this doesn't mean ethical philosop…

How do you get paid as a consultant for ethics? Sounds like a really interesting job and I'm curious how you found your way into this position.

Re: A study of ethicists finds they’re no more ethical than the rest of us

#23

Post by zeulhex »

krapp wrote: post #5
winchling wrote: post #3

>The Tao that can be told is not the eternal Tao. http://tao-in-you.com/lao-tzu-tao-te-ching-chapter-1/ A lot of people say that fantasy fiction has helped them learn morality. A modern form of parables?

Fairy tales, urban legends, myths and stories have been used to teach morality and ethics probably since humans were capable of abstract thought and language. Fantasy fiction is just a commercialized version of the same. To me there's little difference between finding moral lessons in the Beatitudes versus the Jedi Code, which some people do.

Steven Pinker also makes an interesting case that widespread reading of fiction has made people in general more empathetic as they put themselves into a greater variety of shoes.

Re: A study of ethicists finds they’re no more ethical than the rest of us

#24

Post by paultopia »

Judgmentality wrote: post #22
paultopia wrote: post #20

This is consistent with a few previous studies along the same lines, but also shouldn't be that surprising. Ethical knowledge or reasoning not only isn't sufficient for ethical behavior (weakness of will exists!), it might not even be necessary. It's easy to believe, e.g. with Hume (more or less) that we have a pretty good natural sense of right and wrong in day to day behavior. But this doesn't mean ethical philosop…

How do you get paid as a consultant for ethics? Sounds like a really interesting job and I'm curious how you found your way into this position.

Not my main gig (which is professoring at the moment), but: sort of the same way one does any kind of consulting thing: know people at companies that have a problem that needs solving, and be known to have the relevant expertise!

Re: A study of ethicists finds they’re no more ethical than the rest of us

#25

Post by loco5niner »

droithomme wrote: post #2

Thanks. There was a thread on HN yesterday about the benefits of a college education. There was a subthread arguing that without going to a formal college process of study of topics such as ethics and philosophy, a person could not hope to become a moral person, and therefore, the implication goes, college is not only necessary but fundamental to a moral society, and also obviously graduates are more moral and ethica…

In truth, the educated are more likely to be self-deceived (as well as being deceived by the system).

Re: A study of ethicists finds they’re no more ethical than the rest of us

#26

Post by [deleted] »

lawn wrote: post #18
droithomme wrote: post #2

Thanks. There was a thread on HN yesterday about the benefits of a college education. There was a subthread arguing that without going to a formal college process of study of topics such as ethics and philosophy, a person could not hope to become a moral person, and therefore, the implication goes, college is not only necessary but fundamental to a moral society, and also obviously graduates are more moral and ethica…

I've heard similar arguments but from a religious angle. That without religion there's no morality.

[deleted]

Re: A study of ethicists finds they’re no more ethical than the rest of us

#27

Post by [deleted] »

paultopia wrote: post #20

This is consistent with a few previous studies along the same lines, but also shouldn't be that surprising. Ethical knowledge or reasoning not only isn't sufficient for ethical behavior (weakness of will exists!), it might not even be necessary. It's easy to believe, e.g. with Hume (more or less) that we have a pretty good natural sense of right and wrong in day to day behavior. But this doesn't mean ethical philosop…

[deleted]

Re: A study of ethicists finds they’re no more ethical than the rest of us

#28

Post by dpatrick86 »

droithomme wrote: post #2

Thanks. There was a thread on HN yesterday about the benefits of a college education. There was a subthread arguing that without going to a formal college process of study of topics such as ethics and philosophy, a person could not hope to become a moral person, and therefore, the implication goes, college is not only necessary but fundamental to a moral society, and also obviously graduates are more moral and ethica…

That's awfully late in life to be developing a foundation for morality. It seems far more likely to be extremely influenced by early upbringing.

More controversially, there may even be a genetic component too. https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2019/02/190225145632.h...

We are still so early in the understanding of ourselves and, by extension, society.

Re: A study of ethicists finds they’re no more ethical than the rest of us

#29

Post by apocalypstyx »

loco5niner wrote: post #25
droithomme wrote: post #2

Thanks. There was a thread on HN yesterday about the benefits of a college education. There was a subthread arguing that without going to a formal college process of study of topics such as ethics and philosophy, a person could not hope to become a moral person, and therefore, the implication goes, college is not only necessary but fundamental to a moral society, and also obviously graduates are more moral and ethica…

In truth, the educated are more likely to be self-deceived (as well as being deceived by the system).

When I was young, I heard this from Christian fundamentalists. As an adult, I hear it from atheists. (Along with the phrase 'keep your mind open, but not so open your brains fall out', which both groups really seem to like.)
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