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Fuck The Vessel

thebaffler.com

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Re: Fuck The Vessel

#131

Post by caprese »

cgb223 wrote: post #121
caprese wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> an amount that dwarfs the subsidies offered to Amazon one thing I really love about NYC is how easy it is to deflect attention and get what you want exhibit A: "tech workers" make the same amount in NYC as they do in the Bay Area, they fly completely under the radar and the inequality warriors point fingers at finance instead, serving to highlight the fickle nature of an unorganized protest where the cause/perpetua…

> "tech workers" make the same amount in NYC as they do in the Bay Area Is the housing any cheaper? If so I'm moving

The housing is cheaper currently, the food is/can be cheaper. More transportation options exist. Taxes are mostly the same. Activities within city limits are much more numerous, varied, and unique than SF or any city in the bay area. The greater area having attractions too.

Re: Fuck The Vessel

#132

Post by caprese »

notyourday wrote: post #127
cgb223 wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "tech workers" make the same amount in NYC as they do in the Bay Area Is the housing any cheaper? If so I'm moving

2400 sq feet two story 3 bd/2ba apartment with 30 minutes commute to Google via subway $4k/mo

maybe in Hoboken on the New Jersey side??? I mean its a viable option but people don't generally talk about it like its a viable option in public?

Maybe the west side of the Bronx on the express train?

Re: Fuck The Vessel

#133

Post by notyourday »

caprese wrote: post #132
notyourday wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

2400 sq feet two story 3 bd/2ba apartment with 30 minutes commute to Google via subway $4k/mo

maybe in Hoboken on the New Jersey side??? I mean its a viable option but people don't generally talk about it like its a viable option in public? Maybe the west side of the Bronx on the express train?

Brooklyn. Off the L.

Re: Fuck The Vessel

#134

Post by theyoungwolf »

cgb223 wrote: post #121
caprese wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> an amount that dwarfs the subsidies offered to Amazon one thing I really love about NYC is how easy it is to deflect attention and get what you want exhibit A: "tech workers" make the same amount in NYC as they do in the Bay Area, they fly completely under the radar and the inequality warriors point fingers at finance instead, serving to highlight the fickle nature of an unorganized protest where the cause/perpetua…

> "tech workers" make the same amount in NYC as they do in the Bay Area Is the housing any cheaper? If so I'm moving

think the bay still pays more

Re: Fuck The Vessel

#135

Post by cam_l »

deogeo wrote: post #129
cam_l wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Sorry, you'll have to explain more. Like all things, Architecture is a rabbit hole. Every decision has a knock on effect. The floor plate depth is directly related to the amount of light and heat required. The ceiling heights need to be taller to allow ventilation (not feeling too stuffy). The windows need to be taller to let enough light and heat in, the taller the windows the more structure required between them t…

Does this apply to all styles except the steel-and-glass Modern style? E.g. what about the Chrysler and Empire State buildings? And new residential buildings look very different from office buildings, but presumably don't cost an order of magnitude more per usable m^2 - is there something about office/commercial building requirements that tilts the preference towards Modern style?

I can see you are trying to find evidence to support your assumption. No problem, but respectfully, not really interested in playing that endless question and answer game.

Yes, as I suggested before, lettable floor area is king. That is why commercial buildings are made from glass. There are other major differences, and also minor differences with large knock on effects. And no, not every traditional style building is an order of magnitude more expensive than every other style building. And yes, you can fake the stylistic appliqué. And yes, architects have thrashed that dead horse to death time and again over the last 600 years or so.

The truth of it is that architecture is beholden to the same arcane and Byzantine cost structures that effect any other large scale, one off projects. Like those that make software engineering expensive (when programming is so cheap!). Or why don't they just make good movies these days?. The forces acting on architecture are strongly market driven, and if the forces pushed toward traditional methods, then those buildings would be built.

They are not. And, I think architecture would be much easier to understand (and even be effected positively) if people, such as yourself could enumerate their actual requirements of buildings, internally, externally, publicly, privately, phenomenologically, metaphysically, and give some thought to the prioritisation of such requirements, and the deceptive complexity of satisfying them.

If I could make this into a generalisation.. a product is its specification. If you just want a cheaper building (or car, website, or apple) you will get something that resembles that.

Re: Fuck The Vessel

#136

Post by cjhopman »

notyourday wrote: post #122
zwkrt wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes but in the "middle of nowhere" these houses are owned by the middle-of-nowhere gentry. Saying something that is 300k is not expensive shows a lack of perspective I see a lot in this corner of the internet. Growing up in a rural town, my friends parents rented an apartment multiple towns over because they couldn't afford to live in my town (pop. 5k, surrounded by corn fields). All the problems we think are unique…

The problem is that we have a class of intelligentsia such as the author of this piece who thinks she knows better how the rest should live. It is a typical elitist attitude. 300k is not an expensive house. It is 6x 50k/year salary, which is the current not really even stretching for mortgage. In NYC 5k square feet house would cost ~4M if it is in Brooklyn or Queens and it would be much worse than McMansion but I'm s…

The fact that you don't even recognize that 50k/year is significantly higher than the median income in many of these places (e.g. 38k in much of Green Bay WI https://www.incomebyzipcode.com/wisconsin/54303) and the fact that you use 6x income when investopedia say that most people can only afford 2-2.5x (https://www.investopedia.com/articles/pf/05/030905.asp) their income shows just how completely out of touch you are.
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