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Japan plans to lower age of adulthood to 18 (2018)

bbc.com

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Re: Japan plans to lower age of adulthood to 18 (2018)

#61

Post by slavik81 »

scarface74 wrote: post #38
ghaff wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can reduce something without stopping it. I'm not advocating for the policy change that was made. But the evidence suggests it was at least somewhat effective in the goal of reducing teenage accidents in which elevated blood alcohol levels were involved. People can differ on whether that justified the policy change or not.

Can you imagine one case where an 18-21 year old was at a party where people were drinking and they said “I can’t have that beer because I’m underage”.

There's a beer row in some vending machines on public streets in Japan. It seemed that the only enforcement on age limits was a sign that said not to buy beer if you were underage. I took it as an example of the enormous cultural differences between America and Japan.

Re: Japan plans to lower age of adulthood to 18 (2018)

#62

Post by jeltz »

scarface74 wrote: post #38
ghaff wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can reduce something without stopping it. I'm not advocating for the policy change that was made. But the evidence suggests it was at least somewhat effective in the goal of reducing teenage accidents in which elevated blood alcohol levels were involved. People can differ on whether that justified the policy change or not.

Can you imagine one case where an 18-21 year old was at a party where people were drinking and they said “I can’t have that beer because I’m underage”.

Yes, I have seen people refuse because they were underage. But on the other hand those were people who I could not ever imagine driving drunk.

Re: Japan plans to lower age of adulthood to 18 (2018)

#63

Post by magduf »

ekianjo wrote: post #32
veridies wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s no more true than that Asian-Americans have no say in politics. Demographic groups aren’t absolute voting blocks.

If the 18-20 yo population represents 2% of voters (just making it up) and 70% of them don't vote, you will understand their power is absolutely marginal.

Your argument makes no sense, because you're assuming the 18-20yo demographic is voting entirely differently than the 20-25yo demographic, which is obviously a stupid way of thinking when it's stated like that. Those groups are likely going to vote almost exactly the same, so extending the voting age downwards simply gives the younger voting block more power because it gives them more numbers. Also, the idea that 70% of them don't vote is just something you pulled out of your ass, probably based on American voting patterns. Japan isn't America, and assumptions like that are invalid in any argument.

Re: Japan plans to lower age of adulthood to 18 (2018)

#64

Post by magduf »

jgowdy wrote: post #44
superbaconman wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These ages really should be legally aligned. If you're not responsible enough to live your own life, you've no business telling someone else how to live.

Why not avoid artificially grouping those age restrictions out of an artificial sense of "fairness"? I was one of the previously rabid "if you can be sent to war you should be able to have a drink" back in my teens. The two topics aren't related. I insisted that they were to the ends of the earth before, but they aren't. Alcohol is a dangerous trap. Having the age be 21, even with some sneaking it early, is smart. 18…

>When I was in my teens and 20s, I felt like older people were just rigging the rules for their benefit. As I approach 40, let me tell you younger folks something (even if it's useless), we are all on the same team and we're trying to make things the best we can (for you too).

This isn't true at all, at least in America. The Boomers are absolutely pushing for policies that will benefit them at the expense of younger generations. The refusal to reduce carbon emissions and their desire to increase coal mining and usage is a big example of this.

Re: Japan plans to lower age of adulthood to 18 (2018)

#65

Post by 0x14c1de72 »

asutekku wrote: post #42
AlanSE wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The drunk driving argument extends to Japan extremely poorly due to cultural and infrastructure differences. Public transportation in Japan is great. In urban areas it's also quite easy, accessible, and affordable to rent a capsule hotel "room" or net cafe seat. This is true no matter what your age or credit history, they won't ask for your drivers license, you can pay cash. It's honestly strange that I have to state…

The reason why they don’t ask you is you are (most likely) a westerner. In my experience if you are an underage looking japanese buying alcohol alone, they most likely will ask your age. And drunk driving in japan? It’s much more common than you would think.

When I was on exchange in Japan my underage friends from joined me multiple times for bars and not a single time was their ID's checked. I've only had my ID checked during some special event like Halloween in very central areas in Tokyo.

In stores they will not even check ID's or ask your age verbally but you just tap a button that says you are old enough to buy alchohol.

Re: Japan plans to lower age of adulthood to 18 (2018)

#66

Post by slavik81 »

microcolonel wrote: post #5
hnarn wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many countries have laws that require certain types of contracts to have an obligatory right to withdraw within a certain time. In my country, all contracts that have been entered "remotely" for example (over phone, over the Internet, etc.) have this, meaning that if you enter a contract over the phone, it can be nullified within a certain period for any reason. So in these cases, whether you were "conned" or not is…

Though there is a downside. I decided to start working when I was 16, and it was hard to keep business with no right to enforce my own liabilities in the contract.

The right to be held to your side of the bargain is perhaps not immediately obvious as an important right, but there's a decent bit that has been written on the topic. For example:

"Among the legal privileges of corporations, two that are mentioned in textbooks are the right to sue and the "right" to be sued. Who wants to be sued! But the right to be sued is the power to make a promise: to borrow money, to enter a contract, to do business with someone who might be damaged. If suit does arise, the "right" seems a liability in retrospect; beforehand it was a prerequisite to doing business." ~ Thomas Schelling, The Strategy of Conflict

Re: Japan plans to lower age of adulthood to 18 (2018)

#67

Post by taneq »

asutekku wrote: post #42
AlanSE wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The drunk driving argument extends to Japan extremely poorly due to cultural and infrastructure differences. Public transportation in Japan is great. In urban areas it's also quite easy, accessible, and affordable to rent a capsule hotel "room" or net cafe seat. This is true no matter what your age or credit history, they won't ask for your drivers license, you can pay cash. It's honestly strange that I have to state…

The reason why they don’t ask you is you are (most likely) a westerner. In my experience if you are an underage looking japanese buying alcohol alone, they most likely will ask your age. And drunk driving in japan? It’s much more common than you would think.

Can't you just buy alcohol from a vending machine?

(Source: Bought a lot of alcohol from vending machines while I was in Japan. Never got asked for ID.)

Re: Japan plans to lower age of adulthood to 18 (2018)

#68

Post by max76 »

taneq wrote: post #67
asutekku wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The reason why they don’t ask you is you are (most likely) a westerner. In my experience if you are an underage looking japanese buying alcohol alone, they most likely will ask your age. And drunk driving in japan? It’s much more common than you would think.

Can't you just buy alcohol from a vending machine? (Source: Bought a lot of alcohol from vending machines while I was in Japan. Never got asked for ID.)

I only saw a handful of alcohol vending machines when I was in Japan (2018). I heard a rumor they are being phased out.

EDIT: Found a source "In May 1995, to prevent underage drinking, the All Japan Liquor Merchants Association decided to eliminate outdoor alcohol vending machines, so it is now rare to encounter these machines outside." https://www.nippon.com/en/features/h00258/vending-machines-i...

Re: Japan plans to lower age of adulthood to 18 (2018)

#69

Post by taneq »

max76 wrote: post #68
taneq wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can't you just buy alcohol from a vending machine? (Source: Bought a lot of alcohol from vending machines while I was in Japan. Never got asked for ID.)

I only saw a handful of alcohol vending machines when I was in Japan (2018). I heard a rumor they are being phased out. EDIT: Found a source "In May 1995, to prevent underage drinking, the All Japan Liquor Merchants Association decided to eliminate outdoor alcohol vending machines, so it is now rare to encounter these machines outside." https://www.nippon.com/en/features/h00258/vending-machines-i...

Oh, this was in 2012 so they may have disappeared. Shame. :(

Re: Japan plans to lower age of adulthood to 18 (2018)

#70

Post by praneshp »

scarface74 wrote: post #38
ghaff wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can reduce something without stopping it. I'm not advocating for the policy change that was made. But the evidence suggests it was at least somewhat effective in the goal of reducing teenage accidents in which elevated blood alcohol levels were involved. People can differ on whether that justified the policy change or not.

Can you imagine one case where an 18-21 year old was at a party where people were drinking and they said “I can’t have that beer because I’m underage”.

Ha ha you framed the question quite stringently. Even I (haven't been to an american-style party) have been in situations where someone refused alcohol because they were <21.
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