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Apple updates its iMac line

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Re: Apple updates its iMac line

#411

Post by hinkley »

gowld wrote: post #348
CoolGuySteve wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s very likely that the high DRAM prices from 2017 to now have been due to market collusion, similar to what happened in 2010. Like your example shows, they’ve basically set the entire industry back years for a modest profit. It’s heinous.

Is $11/GB a high DRAM price? That's the cost of a standalone stick. Apple DRAM costs 2x, and any other PC vendor's DRAM costs 1.5x-2x but that's vendor lock-in, not collusion.

I used to get more life out of my MBP by spending about $400 on max memory and a faster hard drive. Even with inflation $350 for memory seems a bit high (assuming there comes a day when you can put 32G in one of these things :/ )

Re: Apple updates its iMac line

#412

Post by hinkley »

tambourine_man wrote: post #24

Still selling brand new machines with 5400 rpm HDs. In 2019. It undermines the brand. Any Mac a customer buys should have good enough performance. 5400 spinning disk hasn’t been fast enough for a decade.

When I still gamed, I was one of the first people in my group to get an SSD. A few days later the game glitched the graphics card and I had to reboot. Restarted the machine, the game, voice chat, logged back in and playing again in just under 30 seconds.

That was kind of a big deal. I'd already had a 7200 rpm disk in my old machine and this was still hands down faster. I can't imagine going back to 5400.

Re: Apple updates its iMac line

#413

Post by jimbokun »

ceejayoz wrote: post #23
fiblye wrote: post #13

Bought my iMac 7 years ago with 8GB as the default memory option and a 1TB fusion drive. And here we are, nearly a decade later. Still 8 GB in the newest models. Still 1 TB fusion drives. GPUs haven't even seemed to take a jump over last year's models.

Plenty of folks use an iMac as the primary family machine - email, homework, some Netflix, kids' basic games. 8 GB is entirely sufficient for that. Hell, four probably is. If you're doing Photoshop plus a half dozen VMs, you buy it with more RAM.

Or if you allow all family members to stay logged on with their apps running like we do, you can upgrade to 16GB or 32GB. :)

I bought an iMac a couple years ago because at the time it was the only consumer level Mac being sold new where you could upgrade the RAM yourself.

Re: Apple updates its iMac line

#414

Post by hinkley »

smnrchrds wrote: post #167
js2 wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Something sounds wrong. I have an older 21.5 with the first generation 1 TB fusion and it is not at all slow.

First generation 1TB fusion drives had 128GB of SSD storage. 2017 and 2019 1TB fusion drives have 32GB of SSD storage [1], which is basically just enough for the OS and a couple of apps if you are lucky. People are not exaggerating when they say Apple hardware are regressing, not progressing. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fusion_Drive

Putting/letting Jony Ive on designing the new campus is one of the dumbest things Apple has done. Effectively dereliction of duty.

Now that he's back on task, I'm holding my breath that there are some mea culpas in the next round of hardware updates. If there aren't some significant quality improvements I'll probably still get a new laptop, but I'll be selling my shares.

Re: Apple updates its iMac line

#415

Post by soneil »

js2 wrote: post #391
soneil wrote: post #379

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do understand most of their trade-offs. But these little m2 nvme sticks should be just as easy to expose as ram is. That'd make a huge difference for me. Being locked in to a purchase-time decision doesn't sit well with how quickly SSD capacities and prices evolve.

Yup, I’ve upgraded two Apple laptops already with NVMe adapters and Samsung SSDs. https://www.amazon.com/Sintech-Adapter-Upgrade-2013-2016-201...

I had in mind the 27” imac which technically has replaceable storage, but you need to be comfortable taking a pizza cutter to the glass. While I’m glad for the trapdoor RAM slot, it does feel like a shame there apparently wasn’t any spare space on the 7 square miles of aluminium on the rear of the machine, to put an M2 slot behind a similar trapdoor.

Re: Apple updates its iMac line

#416

Post by jimbokun »

js2 wrote: post #307
todd8 wrote: post #201

It's just frustrating, I switched the household over to Apple devices when OSX came out, and now there really aren't any systems from Apple that look interesting to me. I've been programming since before the (Unix) dawn of time, and Apple devices have been good development machines for me since OSX was released 18 years ago. I'm comfortable on Linux, but the Apple iOS devices and computers are all over my home and in…

I'm in your boat. My history with Apple goes back even longer, to the Apple II and Mac SE. I've lost track of how much Apple gear I've purchased in the last three+ decades. The only non-upgradeable part that cheeses me is the storage. And the battery should be user swappable. Aside from reliability issues like the keyboard/display which Apple obviously has to fix, those are the only two parts which I almost always ne…

"there's no way Steve Jobs would have put up with this shit."

The first thing Jobs did upon returning to Apple is reduce the product line to exactly four products. Consumer and pro laptop, consumer and pro desktop.

Re: Apple updates its iMac line

#417

Post by jimbokun »

WillPostForFood wrote: post #287
todd8 wrote: post #201

It's just frustrating, I switched the household over to Apple devices when OSX came out, and now there really aren't any systems from Apple that look interesting to me. I've been programming since before the (Unix) dawn of time, and Apple devices have been good development machines for me since OSX was released 18 years ago. I'm comfortable on Linux, but the Apple iOS devices and computers are all over my home and in…

> I'd love to see Apple make a system that supported upgradeable memory, SSDs, High capacity hard drives, graphics, and separate larger monitors Apple does a pretty good job supporting the needs of most people, in a slim clean form factor, with the iMac. It supports memory upgrades, and external monitors. There is a small group that needs nearly every component to be upgradeable or swappable, and they offer the Mac P…

"and they offer the Mac Pro for that use case"

Which was never popular with users, never good value for money, never sold very many, and hasn't been seriously updated since 2013.

"I would like to see the hard drive accessible like the memory is."

Allow hard drive and RAM upgrades for iMacs and Mac Book Pros, would instantly make all the performance sensitive customers much happier.

Re: Apple updates its iMac line

#418

Post by jimbokun »

geezerjay wrote: post #380
jwr wrote: post #368

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having used Hackintosh builds for several years, it's not something I want to do anymore. The whole point of using Mac hardware is to get Mac software along with it and be able to concentrate on actual work instead of endless fiddling with the system to get it to work. The Hackintosh experience is cool, but not for people whose goal is to get work done.

> The whole point of using Mac hardware is to get Mac software along with it and be able to concentrate on actual work instead of endless fiddling with the system to get it to work. To some, the point of using a Mac is to be able to develop and test software for Mac hardware using Apple's frameworks, and having to spend 3x the price tag just to get the hardware is something that makes little to no sense. I mean, wher…

"and having to spend 3x the price tag just to get the hardware is something that makes little to no sense."

But still probably cheaper than the value of your time spent building a Hackintosh and keeping it functional.

Re: Apple updates its iMac line

#419

Post by jimbokun »

Crontab wrote: post #402
todd8 wrote: post #201

It's just frustrating, I switched the household over to Apple devices when OSX came out, and now there really aren't any systems from Apple that look interesting to me. I've been programming since before the (Unix) dawn of time, and Apple devices have been good development machines for me since OSX was released 18 years ago. I'm comfortable on Linux, but the Apple iOS devices and computers are all over my home and in…

I like Apple's current lineup but I do think they have lost a certain segment of users: people who don't care about appearance or thinness and just want a modestly priced, upgradeable box.

"people who don't care about appearance or thinness and just want a modestly priced, upgradeable box."

Not sure those people were ever Apple customers.

Re: Apple updates its iMac line

#420

Post by varenc »

slantyyz wrote: post #301
WillPostForFood wrote: post #287

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'd love to see Apple make a system that supported upgradeable memory, SSDs, High capacity hard drives, graphics, and separate larger monitors Apple does a pretty good job supporting the needs of most people, in a slim clean form factor, with the iMac. It supports memory upgrades, and external monitors. There is a small group that needs nearly every component to be upgradeable or swappable, and they offer the Mac P…

>> they offer the Mac Pro for that use case. I'm not sure I buy this as an argument until the new Mac Pro is released. Having said that, the Mac Pro is prohibitively expensive for a lot of people. I think a lot of people want something between a Mac Mini and a Mac Pro. Something that could be called Mac "Midi" that would allow for some commodity parts (ram, storage, gpu) to be used. >> I don't see a scenario where th…

I have one of the recent Mac Mini's and upgraded the RAM and hooked up an external eGPU that's working flawlessly. (But for an easy experience you're limited to AMD cards and apple approved enclosures...) For an apple product, it was quite user upgradable.

(Technically Apple says the RAM isn't user upgradable, but it's still relatively easy.)

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