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How MSG Got a Bad Rap (2016)

fivethirtyeight.com

171–180 of 190 posts

Re: How MSG Got a Bad Rap (2016)

#171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You want a credible study? Eat a teaspoon of MSG & try not to have a migraine.

That would be approximately the same as trying to eat only a tablespoon of salt. Which would definitely cause headaches, at least from dehydration. You're only supposed to use a half teaspoon to flavor six whole servings of soup. It's an incredibly strong flavor enhancer, and is really not recommended for solo consumption.

> Which would definitely cause headaches, at least from dehydration.

In the summers, when I sweat a lot due to running and cycling, I dump that much salt into a bowl of soup. I don't have any ill effects. In fact, beefing up the salt intake wards off muscle cramps and lethargy.

Japan's allowance for daily salt intake for men sets an upper bound of 12 grams (salt, not sodium).

You have it backwards, by the way. MSG has a rather large molecular weight compared to NaCL. A given mass of MSG has less sodium than the same mass of salt. This is very easy to get in precise numbers: the molecular weight of MSG 169.111 g/mol is and of salt 58.44 g/mol. A mole of MSG has the same amount of sodium as a mole of salt: one weighs 169g. the other 54g: close to triple. Secondly, MSG is less dense than salt: the same mass of MSG takes 33% more space than a given mass of salt. This magnifies the difference. Basically if we have equal sized heaps of salt and MSG, the MSG has about 1/4 of the sodium compared to the salt.

In a restaurant, they can easily dump a teaspoon of MSG (about 4g) into your mapotofu or noodle soup or whatever. Manufactured products of good brands are going to be reasonable. Someone holding a shaker MSG over a pot isn't going to be that much. Not consistently so, day in, day out. Consider that some of the ingredients already have MSG (e.g. marinated or processed meats), then there is natural glutamate in some of it, and then they add some half teaspoon (about 2g) of MSG crystals. Things add up.

Re: How MSG Got a Bad Rap (2016)

#172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Disclaimer: I'm married to a Chinese person, I speak (some) Chinese, I've been to China. I love Chinese food. There's no racism in claiming that quite a lot of the "Chinese" food one finds available in Europe is indeed quite dodgy.

> Disclaimer: I'm married to a Chinese person, I speak (some) Chinese, I've been to China. I love Chinese food. "I'm not racist some of my best friends are $race" in third comment on the page, congratulations!

Instead of taking the discussion straight to toxic tropes, how about assuming good faith, as the guidelines ask? Here's the full version:

"Please respond to the strongest plausible interpretation of what someone says, not a weaker one that's easier to criticize. Assume good faith."

They also ask you not to snark, and not to post flamebait. (And personal attacks, which you unfortunately crossed into in this thread, are right out.)

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: How MSG Got a Bad Rap (2016)

#173
post #67
post #62

fivethirtyeight.com: "That MSG causes health problems may have thrived on racially charged biases from the outset." Yeah, sure. Couldn't have just been the usual, nonsensical intellectual fashion of the sophisticates ("ooh, chemicals are so bad!"). No, today's nonsensical intellectual fashion of sophisticates ("oooh, racism explains everything!") has finally figured out what was wrong with yesterday's nonsensical int…

No, a significant part of it (in the UK) has definitely been stereotypes around Chinese food being somehow 'dodgy'. Clearly racism doesn't 'explain everything' and the forces you mention played a part, but you're the only one who brought up that strawman. (You should think carefully about why you're so desperate to disingenuously downplay the effects of racism on modern attitudes.)

Personal attacks are not ok on HN and we ban accounts that cross into that zone repeatedly. Can you please edit such bits out in the future? Your comment makes your point just fine without that last sentence.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: How MSG Got a Bad Rap (2016)

#174
post #62

fivethirtyeight.com: "That MSG causes health problems may have thrived on racially charged biases from the outset." Yeah, sure. Couldn't have just been the usual, nonsensical intellectual fashion of the sophisticates ("ooh, chemicals are so bad!"). No, today's nonsensical intellectual fashion of sophisticates ("oooh, racism explains everything!") has finally figured out what was wrong with yesterday's nonsensical int…

You started an unnecessary but wretched flamewar with this comment, and broke the site guidelines by doing so. (And again by perpetuating it, along with others below.)

Could you please review and follow them in the future? They include "Eschew flamebait" and "Don't be snarky."

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: How MSG Got a Bad Rap (2016)

#175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That would be approximately the same as trying to eat only a tablespoon of salt. Which would definitely cause headaches, at least from dehydration. You're only supposed to use a half teaspoon to flavor six whole servings of soup. It's an incredibly strong flavor enhancer, and is really not recommended for solo consumption.

> Which would definitely cause headaches, at least from dehydration. In the summers, when I sweat a lot due to running and cycling, I dump that much salt into a bowl of soup. I don't have any ill effects. In fact, beefing up the salt intake wards off muscle cramps and lethargy. Japan's allowance for daily salt intake for men sets an upper bound of 12 grams (salt, not sodium). You have it backwards, by the way. MSG ha…

Most restaurants will also oversalt the food.

If the problem with the ingredient is that it's being overused, the problem is not the ingredient, it's the cook.

Re: How MSG Got a Bad Rap (2016)

#176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That would be approximately the same as trying to eat only a tablespoon of salt. Which would definitely cause headaches, at least from dehydration. You're only supposed to use a half teaspoon to flavor six whole servings of soup. It's an incredibly strong flavor enhancer, and is really not recommended for solo consumption.

> Which would definitely cause headaches, at least from dehydration. In the summers, when I sweat a lot due to running and cycling, I dump that much salt into a bowl of soup. I don't have any ill effects. In fact, beefing up the salt intake wards off muscle cramps and lethargy. Japan's allowance for daily salt intake for men sets an upper bound of 12 grams (salt, not sodium). You have it backwards, by the way. MSG ha…

> In a restaurant, they can easily dump a teaspoon of MSG (about 4g) into your mapotofu or noodle soup

That seems unlikely to me - that is a lot of MSG. I occasionally use MSG when cooking at home, and quickly realised that any more than a small pinch per serving completely ruins a dish.

Also, do you seriously put a tablespoon of salt in a single bowl of soup? I can't understand how that could be palatable!

Re: How MSG Got a Bad Rap (2016)

#177
post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unless tomatoes, Parmesan cheese, and aged beef also give you headaches every time, then its guaranteed not to be the MSG.

Eat a teaspoon of MSG. Remember, "its guaranteed not to be the MSG."

I might be willing to try this, but I am afraid of the outcome. The headaches are violent. I have had these headaches decades and I know my triggers. MSG is the king of triggers.

Re: How MSG Got a Bad Rap (2016)

#178
post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You'd have to be crazy to add 2.5 grams worth of MSG to a single meal. Accent calls for using like 1/10th that amount in soup. That's no different than using 10x as much salt as a recipe calls for, it's not going to turn out so great.

I work in restaurants and have seen chefs add two heaping table spoons of it to a pot of soup without hesitating.

Depending on the size of the pot that might be about right. The problem I have with the studies referenced is that they wildly overestimated MSG intake and their threshold effect was at a level similar to eating one of those heaping tablespoons of MSG by itself with no food. I'm sure MSG produces some noticeable effect at some point but those studies make it seem like the threshold they found was consistent with the amount you could plausibly eat in a normal meal seasoned with MSG.

Re: How MSG Got a Bad Rap (2016)

#179
post #6

Sliced tomatoes sprinkled with salt, pepper and msg on toast are very good. Although I imagine if you can get decent vine ripened heirloom tomatoes where you are the msg would probably be unnecessary.

> decent vine ripened heirloom tomatoes where you are If this is in America, not grown in your own garden, I'd love to hear where this is, because tomatoes in Seattle are absolutely terrible.

The south east has amazing tomatoes. I do miss them as I'm currently in Colorado and it's hard to find good full flavored tomatoes.

Re: How MSG Got a Bad Rap (2016)

#180
post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You'd have to be crazy to add 2.5 grams worth of MSG to a single meal. Accent calls for using like 1/10th that amount in soup. That's no different than using 10x as much salt as a recipe calls for, it's not going to turn out so great.

I work in restaurants and have seen chefs add two heaping table spoons of it to a pot of soup without hesitating.

That's something like 40 to 50 grams. Say it's an 8 liter pot, serving 16. That's like 2.5g to 3.1g per person, ouch! Then there is glutamate in that pot already from natural sources as well as possibly ingredients like processed meats and whatnot.
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