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How MSG Got a Bad Rap (2016)

fivethirtyeight.com

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Re: How MSG Got a Bad Rap (2016)

#161

Post by dymk »

alexandercrohde wrote: post #157
dymk wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Were the tests blinded? Did you do an additional test with just salt?

Does he need to? It's his own body. If I burn my hand on a stove, am I obligated to to do a blinded A/B test with N=15 before I decide, for my own personal case, that the hot stove caused the burn mark? I don't get why you're putting people on trial for noticing their own individual reactions to food. The article itself admits some people are sensitive to MSG.

Yes, for something like “msg causes headaches”, that needs to be blinded to discern if there’s a placebo effect happening. It’s not nearly as straightforward as “touch hot surface, get burned”.

Re: How MSG Got a Bad Rap (2016)

#162

Post by espeed »

YeGoblynQueenne wrote: post #128

It's the first I hear about "Chinese Restaurant Syndrome" but MSG is 12.28g per 100g sodium and so should be avoided by, or at the very least restricted in the diets of, people on a low-sodium diet, such as hypertensives, kidney patients and diabetics. _________________ Source of the 12.28g per 100g claim: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5694874/ Which actually advocates for the use of MSG to reduce sodi…

See this previous in-depth discussion that includes references and links to the original Harvard and USG research findings on the issues with MSG, aspartame and artificial sweeteners/flavors in general, like why it's banned in baby food: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6703802

Re: How MSG Got a Bad Rap (2016)

#163

Post by astura »

mlrtime wrote: post #94
pjc50 wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't presume, ask; something like "do you have any dietary requirements?" along with a dinner invitation. Covers everything from vegetarianism to highly specific allergies. Also puts the ball in the other person's court to be clear upfront before anything is cooked or purchased.

Nobody will mention MSG in this scenario unless they have a very acute allergy to it.

If they don't want to consume something they need to say so.

Re: How MSG Got a Bad Rap (2016)

#164

Post by kazinator »

drewmol wrote: post #58
Uberphallus wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No[0], it won't [1], that's the point of the article. [0] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4870486 [1] https://academic.oup.com/jn/article-abstract/125/11/2891S/47...

from [0]: >Because of the absence of proper blinding, and the inconsistency of the findings, we conclude that further studies are required to evaluate whether or not a causal relationship exists between MSG ingestion and headache.

And that's from people paid by their boss to show that there is no such effect.

Re: How MSG Got a Bad Rap (2016)

#165

Post by GordonS »

YeGoblynQueenne wrote: post #128

It's the first I hear about "Chinese Restaurant Syndrome" but MSG is 12.28g per 100g sodium and so should be avoided by, or at the very least restricted in the diets of, people on a low-sodium diet, such as hypertensives, kidney patients and diabetics. _________________ Source of the 12.28g per 100g claim: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5694874/ Which actually advocates for the use of MSG to reduce sodi…

When cooking with MSG you generally use a very small amount, so the sodium isn't going to be an issue - I've found any more than a small pinch can completely ruin a dish.

Re: How MSG Got a Bad Rap (2016)

#166

Post by __david__ »

alexandercrohde wrote: post #157
dymk wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Were the tests blinded? Did you do an additional test with just salt?

Does he need to? It's his own body. If I burn my hand on a stove, am I obligated to to do a blinded A/B test with N=15 before I decide, for my own personal case, that the hot stove caused the burn mark? I don't get why you're putting people on trial for noticing their own individual reactions to food. The article itself admits some people are sensitive to MSG.

Because people are notoriously terrible at this kind of self diagnosis.

I'm going to answer an anecdote with an anecdote here, but I was getting headaches that were completely correlated with food containing MSG. I "researched it" (cursorily google searched) and found that MSG was totally safe so I didn't want to believe it, but the correlation was there. Later I found out I had high blood pressure—the high MSG foods were also high sodium and the sodium was kicking my blood pressure up really high and causing headaches. When I got my blood pressure under control I tried MSG again and no headaches at all.

The body is complicated and things aren't always what they seem to be to our pattern seeking brains.

Re: How MSG Got a Bad Rap (2016)

#167

Post by equalunique »

krageon wrote: post #69
kazinator wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Reactions to MSG are not allergic. It's not like eating something cooked in a pot that previously had shrimp type of thing. A fairly macroscopically large dose of the stuff does something with the blood flow in veins around the head or sensitivity of nerves or something. It's not a serious medical condition, like an allergic attack; just a nuisance.

Can you provide some studies that prove the effects you are describing? I have definitely looked, but the only credible studies I've found conclude there is absolutely no way to get an adverse response unless you are eating multiple grams of pure MSG on a completely empty stomach with no other food. That is the "best case" scenario, there's plenty of studies concluding they can't find any evidence at all.

You want a credible study? Eat a teaspoon of MSG & try not to have a migraine.

Re: How MSG Got a Bad Rap (2016)

#168

Post by equalunique »

bjl wrote: post #83
waynecochran wrote: post #79

MSG will give me a headache every frickin' time. Guaranteed.

Unless tomatoes, Parmesan cheese, and aged beef also give you headaches every time, then its guaranteed not to be the MSG.

Eat a teaspoon of MSG. Remember, "its guaranteed not to be the MSG."

Re: How MSG Got a Bad Rap (2016)

#169

Post by equalunique »

MertsA wrote: post #48
kazinator wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 2.5 grams of msg for a 50kg person MSG is slightly more dense than sugar, with a specific gravity of 1.6 and comes in a crystalline form that resembles sugar. 4 grams of sugar is about a teaspoon, and the same can be expected of MSG. They can easily dump half a teaspoon of the stuff into your soup or sauce in a restaurant, treating it like salt or sugar. This amazing paper is valuable not just for its work on rats,…

You'd have to be crazy to add 2.5 grams worth of MSG to a single meal. Accent calls for using like 1/10th that amount in soup. That's no different than using 10x as much salt as a recipe calls for, it's not going to turn out so great.

I work in restaurants and have seen chefs add two heaping table spoons of it to a pot of soup without hesitating.

Re: How MSG Got a Bad Rap (2016)

#170

Post by bobthepanda »

equalunique wrote: post #167
krageon wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you provide some studies that prove the effects you are describing? I have definitely looked, but the only credible studies I've found conclude there is absolutely no way to get an adverse response unless you are eating multiple grams of pure MSG on a completely empty stomach with no other food. That is the "best case" scenario, there's plenty of studies concluding they can't find any evidence at all.

You want a credible study? Eat a teaspoon of MSG & try not to have a migraine.

That would be approximately the same as trying to eat only a tablespoon of salt. Which would definitely cause headaches, at least from dehydration.

You're only supposed to use a half teaspoon to flavor six whole servings of soup. It's an incredibly strong flavor enhancer, and is really not recommended for solo consumption.

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