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25M Brits would struggle in a cashless society

which.co.uk

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Re: 25M Brits would struggle in a cashless society

#31

Post by Broken_Hippo »

awakeasleep wrote: post #11
cascom wrote: post #2

The implications of a cashless society on privacy are terrifying

The implications on life for the poor are terrifying! Businesses would love to be able to exclude people too poor to use their services from society- It's a real ugly situation. Like a decentralized apartheid based on financial status. Without the government stepping in and trying to prevent this discrimination, there is no one to stand up for these human being's lives

"Businesses would love to be able to exclude people too poor to use their services from society"

I'm pretty sure there are large swaths of society that would really hurt even though some would exclude folks. Everything from fast food to grocery stores to cheap clothing outlets.

Re: 25M Brits would struggle in a cashless society

#32

Post by Broken_Hippo »

verbify wrote: post #8
mymythisisthis wrote: post #5

You need to keep things off the books sometimes. Try saving up for a significant other's gift, if you can't keep a few things hidden.

Do you not have a personal bank account that your significant other doesn't audit?

While this is common where I live now (Norway), it is not common in the states. Married couples (or just couples) often have a joint account. It was more difficult to transfer money between two people's accounts as well, though there is a chance this has changed recently.

Re: 25M Brits would struggle in a cashless society

#33

Post by frosted-flakes »

mschuetz wrote: post #20
mymythisisthis wrote: post #5

You need to keep things off the books sometimes. Try saving up for a significant other's gift, if you can't keep a few things hidden.

The concept of not having your own private bank account that isn't shared with your significant other or anyone else baffles me.

Why? It baffles me that a husband and wife don't trust each other enough to pool their resources.

Re: 25M Brits would struggle in a cashless society

#34

Post by jdietrich »

Retra wrote: post #26
ACS_Solver wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is incorrect for EU countries. The EU, through Directive 2014/92, mandates that banks cannot refuse basic accounts to legal EU residents (unless they believe you're laundering money or financing terror groups). I live in an essentially cashless country, but even countries where cash is still used would be very hard to live in without a bank account, so that legislation is important.

Do if you're not a legal EU resident, you will be unable to purchase food/lodging/transportation?

Monzo will give a bank account to pretty much anyone with a verifiable form of ID, regardless of their residency status.

https://monzo.com/blog/2018/05/29/getting-bank-account-immig...

Re: 25M Brits would struggle in a cashless society

#35

Post by Amezarak »

anoncoward111 wrote: post #15
argd678 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What’s the reason they wouldn’t give you an account? It seems like helping people get bank accounts would be what you’d want, though the IT issues arround outages and lack of network services in area is a hard one.

In the USA, not meeting minimum deposit requirements, having a bad credit history or trackrecord with banks, not paying monthly fees, and not knowing how to use a computer can all preclude someone from being able to qualify or use a bank account. I've personally seen friends struggle with all of the above, but the reloadable AMEX cards at Walmart seem to be doing well to fill in the gaps (except for not being able to…

> not paying monthly fees,

It really gets my goat that some banks even charge monthly fees. Having a checking and savings account should be free. Withdrawing from and depositing to the account should be free. Writing checks and using a debit card should be free.

I am not a fan of overdraft fees, but I can see that they're at least justifiable.

Please don't patronize banks that have these fees.

Re: 25M Brits would struggle in a cashless society

#36

Post by jstanley »

ACS_Solver wrote: post #21
jstanley wrote: post #9

One of the problems with a cashless society is that the banks aren't required to give you a bank account. If none of the banks will give you a bank account, and there's no such thing as cash... then you're just not allowed to have money. That shouldn't be a position that it is possible to get into.

That is incorrect for EU countries. The EU, through Directive 2014/92, mandates that banks cannot refuse basic accounts to legal EU residents (unless they believe you're laundering money or financing terror groups). I live in an essentially cashless country, but even countries where cash is still used would be very hard to live in without a bank account, so that legislation is important.

> banks cannot refuse basic accounts to legal EU residents (unless they believe you're laundering money or financing terror groups).

This is little comfort if you're not a legal EU resident, or if they believe you're laundering money or financing terror groups (whether you actually are or not).

As long as there are any caveats to "cannot refuse bank accounts to all people" then switching to a cashless society would create an underclass of people who are just not allowed to have money.

Re: 25M Brits would struggle in a cashless society

#37

Post by ACS_Solver »

Retra wrote: post #26
ACS_Solver wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is incorrect for EU countries. The EU, through Directive 2014/92, mandates that banks cannot refuse basic accounts to legal EU residents (unless they believe you're laundering money or financing terror groups). I live in an essentially cashless country, but even countries where cash is still used would be very hard to live in without a bank account, so that legislation is important.

Do if you're not a legal EU resident, you will be unable to purchase food/lodging/transportation?

If you're not an EU resident, it's your own responsibility to have some valid means of payment from your home country. Which could also be cash you exchanged for the local currency, though if cash is all you have, some countries could prove difficult. Or you could find a local bank that will give you an account - they may of course do so even when not legally required.

But to take an extreme case, there's nothing preventing you from getting yourself into trouble due to a lack of valid payment methods. For example, Americans have visa-free access to the EU, so nobody will check their finances, and an American could theoretically land somewhere in the EU without a payment card and only carrying US dollars, which aren't legal tender.

Re: 25M Brits would struggle in a cashless society

#38

Post by anoncoward111 »

techsupporter wrote: post #19
anoncoward111 wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the USA, not meeting minimum deposit requirements, having a bad credit history or trackrecord with banks, not paying monthly fees, and not knowing how to use a computer can all preclude someone from being able to qualify or use a bank account. I've personally seen friends struggle with all of the above, but the reloadable AMEX cards at Walmart seem to be doing well to fill in the gaps (except for not being able to…

For what it’s worth, the Bluebird reloadable Amex cards at Wal-Mart now offer direct deposit as a feature. In case that’s relevant to anyone reading.

hey nice!!! I really appreciate that info. Definitely a game changer then. I know a guy who was going to checks cashed, every week, paying those fees, cash under the mattress etc etc etc. If only he know Bluebird was around the corner! He eventually got approved at Ally

Re: 25M Brits would struggle in a cashless society

#39

Post by deogeo »

ACS_Solver wrote: post #21
jstanley wrote: post #9

One of the problems with a cashless society is that the banks aren't required to give you a bank account. If none of the banks will give you a bank account, and there's no such thing as cash... then you're just not allowed to have money. That shouldn't be a position that it is possible to get into.

That is incorrect for EU countries. The EU, through Directive 2014/92, mandates that banks cannot refuse basic accounts to legal EU residents (unless they believe you're laundering money or financing terror groups). I live in an essentially cashless country, but even countries where cash is still used would be very hard to live in without a bank account, so that legislation is important.

> unless they believe you're laundering money or financing terror groups

Do they have to prove this, or is their belief enough? And are we okay with the punishment for money laundering being death by starvation and homelessness?

Re: 25M Brits would struggle in a cashless society

#40

Post by anoncoward111 »

Amezarak wrote: post #35
anoncoward111 wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the USA, not meeting minimum deposit requirements, having a bad credit history or trackrecord with banks, not paying monthly fees, and not knowing how to use a computer can all preclude someone from being able to qualify or use a bank account. I've personally seen friends struggle with all of the above, but the reloadable AMEX cards at Walmart seem to be doing well to fill in the gaps (except for not being able to…

> not paying monthly fees, It really gets my goat that some banks even charge monthly fees. Having a checking and savings account should be free. Withdrawing from and depositing to the account should be free. Writing checks and using a debit card should be free. I am not a fan of overdraft fees, but I can see that they're at least justifiable. Please don't patronize banks that have these fees.

Highly agreed my friend. I have never ever been charged a single fee for anything by my credit union. I've been there for 10 years now. Aside from the money they make loaning out my deposits there, I don't think they've ever made a cent off me. They have a direct deposit from my employer, but they pay me 1% APY monthly and I am sure they're losing money on me in that regard,
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