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Gwern's Law: Ads cost you a tenth of your users

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Re: Gwern's Law: Ads cost you a tenth of your users

#101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What? Ads open in new tabs.

The focus changes to that tab, typically. It’s not a big difference hitting a back button or closing a tab/window, is it? Some users are confused by this, being less familiar with the browser interface, and the effect of interruption is the same.

I guess that's a possibility, I'm not good at thinking like non-technical users.

Re: Gwern's Law: Ads cost you a tenth of your users

#102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m about to release a fun little ambient physics based puzzle game on iOS and have been debating this. To me ads are a stain on what I consider my art. But at the same time I want to monetize and wonder if people will skip over a $1.99 download. What do you think? Ads with the option to unlock? Seems gross though... maybe free with paid version that includes level editor or additional level packs?

I think the classic "shareware demo" model is a good one, have some free stuff to introduce the user and make sure they like the game, then give them a wall and tell them to pay if they want more. It's fair to them and fair to you. It doesn't violate their privacy, it makes sure your customers actually want to be your customers (reducing chargebacks because the game has an issue for someone) and you get paid without…

Yes. As long as you clearly indicate upfront that it's a demo.

Re: Gwern's Law: Ads cost you a tenth of your users

#103
post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why don't you use an adblocker or pay for YouTube premium to support your content creators.

My conscious choice NOT to pay premium. Content creators already get $$ for views.

Why do you think youtube is willing to pay for views?

Re: Gwern's Law: Ads cost you a tenth of your users

#104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe release a couple of levels for free and if they like it they can buy the full game?

I have made an app for iOS, and it is about helping children between on the ages 4-8 read. It took me 1 second to decide "free with ads" vs "0.99". It costs 0.99, and I don't regret the 'small' sales. I prefer that people's children are not tracked by advertisers, facebook (that bloody ping on 31.13.x.x) and other trackers.

I'm surprised that COPPA allows devs to have geo-tracking of users who haven't confirmed they are over 13.

Re: Gwern's Law: Ads cost you a tenth of your users

#105
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have troubles with the concept of a "non-intrusive" ad - If you don't notice it to any degree, it's not doing its job, and if you DO notice it to any degree, it's intrusive and disruptive (to a matching degree) I think you mean "Nobody cares ENOUGH" rather than "Nobody cares", and that's a big distinction.

> If you don't notice it to any degree, it's not doing its job That's a subjective statement. The giant billboards of pepsi with a celebrity doesn't register as an Ad as much as a recognition of someone of interest with a subliminal associative positive reinforcement of a brand. Nobody cares about what Matthew McConaughey thinks about cars, but everyone knows he's associated with a specific brand. Ewan McGregor, in c…

Similarly, the toxicity of ads in your daily life is nearly possible to perceive without completely disconnecting from the internet, cities, tv, etc.

Re: Gwern's Law: Ads cost you a tenth of your users

#106
post #78
post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wouldn't the incentives go the other way? I'd imagine Google wants people to get to sites that serve ads from Google so they can collect fees.

Ads don't affect SEO. It would allow websites to essentially pay for higher search results. There are tools that come with using ads that allow for insights into better SEO though - e.g. Adwords keyword planner.

> would allow websites to essentially pay for higher search results. //

Isn't this exactly what Google does? Paid placements put you above organic results in the SERPs, presumably other search sites do that too.

Re: Gwern's Law: Ads cost you a tenth of your users

#107
post #12

Not having ads costs you 100% of your members if it's the only way to monetize your content (not all content is suited to be supported by paywalls or Patreon).

Is the content worth anything then? Why not just distribute it through torrents or ipfs or something?

Re: Gwern's Law: Ads cost you a tenth of your users

#108
post #32

I believe it. There are a lot of games that I downloaded from the app store and really liked initially. However, I noticed a pattern. At first, ads seemed to be optional (i.e double your gems by watching an ad!) However, after about 10 minutes of playing, I'd see an ad. No big deal. But then it got more and more aggressive. Pretty soon there was an ad after every single level, (plus the bonus ad if you want to double…

I've seen a five year old play those games and talk about how much he really needs that $100 gem pack. I wonder if these will have any lasting effect on how kids of today understand value.

Parents today have to train kids early. Mine learned by age 3 that any non-animated video content on YouTube was an ad that needed to be skipped. Not perfect, but a great start. Constantly drill into them that these are ads, and ads are bad people trying to trick them, and that ads should be avoided, in apps, websites, billboards, etc.

I'm not any advertising, but the only good ad is an ad I asked to see, as when I'm using a web-search-engine for a product.

Re: Gwern's Law: Ads cost you a tenth of your users

#109
post #44

If a game doesn't offer any way to pay to remove ads, it's an instant uninstall for me. If a game does offer it, but doesn't let me play for long enough to decide whether I like the game before it starts serving up unskippable ads, I uninstall it. Most games simply don't give enough time to decide if you even like it before they start throwing ads at you. That seems like a terrible policy in general, regardless of wh…

All this feedback is great. I'm working on a little competitive multiplayer game for Android (and soon iOS) as a side project.

I was thinking about showing ads after every other match w/ the option to pay out and now I think I'll only show them past a certain rank, or just put up a pay wall.

Re: Gwern's Law: Ads cost you a tenth of your users

#110
post #12

Not having ads costs you 100% of your members if it's the only way to monetize your content (not all content is suited to be supported by paywalls or Patreon).

Is the content worth anything then? Why not just distribute it through torrents or ipfs or something?

I guarantee you that you read tons of content that you wouldn't pay for. Hacker news itself is a big ad for Ycombinator.
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