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The $2M Urinal: Why Hard Work Doesn’t Cut It (2018)

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Re: The $2M Urinal: Why Hard Work Doesn’t Cut It (2018)

#131

Post by jmhnilbog »

MagicPropmaker wrote: post #125
redunculous5 wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But at what point does daring rule-breaking degenerate into mere gimmickry. I guess I can understand why piece generated so much interest in it's time, but since then we've been subjected to a relentless parade of urinals, cow corpses, faeces, signed brillo boxes etc. At this point we've seen the emperor naked ad nauseum

The _second_ time it's done! The way I see it, the first person to hang an all white canvas in an art gallery is a genius. The second, third, and fourth, not so much.

Eventually it becomes interesting again, though. The guy who does nothing but white canvases gets a degree of notoriety after a while. And the three thousand, two hundredth guy who does nothing but white canvases blows up because now it's funny that people are still doing that.

'First!', 'Frist!!!', 'FIRST!!!1111lol!' and other web comment poop is born of the same impulse.

Re: The $2M Urinal: Why Hard Work Doesn’t Cut It (2018)

#132

Post by iguy »

barbecue_sauce wrote: post #98
paganel wrote: post #67

Whenever people discuss about contemporary art I get reminded of these incredibly poignant Soviet war paintings [1] which manage to partially describe what the atrocities on the Eastern Front meant for the people involved, but which are nevertheless a lot less well-known compared to contemporary art "darlings" like Jackson Pollock whose works don't tell me absolutely anything and who had his career propped up by the…

These paintings are interesting as a sort of juxtaposition of the soviet "Socialist Realism" style with the harsh reality of war. They are also clearly technically adept. Jackson Pollock's paintings are interesting because he was the first to apply his technique in a studied way. They don't translate well to the digital era, but there is a certain arresting physicality to them when you see one in real life. Many of t…

Pollock is an odd target here in a way, because the man was actually skilled, he produced things which proved hard to copy. Unlike a lot of later very-abstract artists, who really were all about their timing / positioning / contacts etc.

I would have to google a lot but there was a nice mathematical investigation of this, in which the summary was something like that he produced a very consistent scaling of details from very small to quite large, in a way which matches natural scenes. Whereas fake Pollocks don't show this, and perhaps that is why they aren't as pleasing.

Re: The $2M Urinal: Why Hard Work Doesn’t Cut It (2018)

#133

Post by komali2 »

PowerfulWizard wrote: post #106
paganel wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I tried to understand contemporary art, up to a point, there was a time when I used to buy each issue of the FT - Weekend Edition so that I could read Georgina Adam’s articles on what was the hippest thing being transacted and the like, but in the end pretty much all of it meant nothing to me. Reguarding the representation of war, I’m afraid 200-year old paintings don’t do it for me anymore, modern warfare is so much…

I like the Goya painting in particular because a firing squad still looks the same: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Du39t4jWsAIe6_b.jpg . If any notable art came out of the Iraqi wars it is probably hanging in Baghdad, we might find out about it eventually.

ISIS has put out a great deal of notable art, in the form of propaganda videos.

In the same way that Mao era paintings are valuable in understanding the history of early communist China, I believe the ISIS videos will be valuable to future historians in understanding how the radicalization and subsequent wars in the Middle East happened.

Re: The $2M Urinal: Why Hard Work Doesn’t Cut It (2018)

#134

Post by GlenTheMachine »

paganel wrote: post #100
PowerfulWizard wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So, I personally get an emotional response to Pollock, especially that particular one, I actually have a MoMA catalog on my bookshelf with that entry bookmarked with my admission ticket from 2010 when I went to see it ( https://imgur.com/a/hFBR7Nu ). The size is a factor as well, there is no way to look at it on a computer screen that is close to how you look at it in person ( https://www.moma.org/wp/inside_out/wp-co…

I tried to understand contemporary art, up to a point, there was a time when I used to buy each issue of the FT - Weekend Edition so that I could read Georgina Adam’s articles on what was the hippest thing being transacted and the like, but in the end pretty much all of it meant nothing to me. Reguarding the representation of war, I’m afraid 200-year old paintings don’t do it for me anymore, modern warfare is so much…

Goya's black paintings do a pretty good job of depicting the horrors of war, and being timeless as well. At least to me.

I got to see these in the Prado last year. It was a piety emotionally stunning experience.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Paintings#/media/File:Fr...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Paintings#/media/File:La...

Re: The $2M Urinal: Why Hard Work Doesn’t Cut It (2018)

#135

Post by zachkatz »

krapp wrote: post #130
redunculous5 wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But at what point does daring rule-breaking degenerate into mere gimmickry. I guess I can understand why piece generated so much interest in it's time, but since then we've been subjected to a relentless parade of urinals, cow corpses, faeces, signed brillo boxes etc. At this point we've seen the emperor naked ad nauseum

At that point it becomes a meme. Are memes art?

Memes are absolutely art. Why not?

That's actually the thesis behind my startup, Memes On Canvas: https://www.memesoncanvas.com

Re: The $2M Urinal: Why Hard Work Doesn’t Cut It (2018)

#136

Post by jacobush »

JansjoFromIkea wrote: post #95
paganel wrote: post #67

Whenever people discuss about contemporary art I get reminded of these incredibly poignant Soviet war paintings [1] which manage to partially describe what the atrocities on the Eastern Front meant for the people involved, but which are nevertheless a lot less well-known compared to contemporary art "darlings" like Jackson Pollock whose works don't tell me absolutely anything and who had his career propped up by the…

Not even a Pollock fan but the idea that a scan of a Pollock painting is at all similar to standing in front of one seems like a huge stretch. They absolutely huge and the paint is layered on very thick in a way that almost forces you to deconstruct the process of its production as you look at it. This other painting on the other hand, I'd be very surprised if there's more to be gotten from seeing it in person that w…

I don't travel much or look at much art, but I have happened to seen that Pollock. It is true. You can't ignore it, it's very palpable. I'm not sure I liked it, but I definitely felt something strongly.

Re: The $2M Urinal: Why Hard Work Doesn’t Cut It (2018)

#137

Post by mindslight »

wazoox wrote: post #32

Contemporary art is a sophisticated form of money laundering for the very rich. As it almost completely exempt from taxation, it's an ideal vehicle, relatively fungible and open to crazy speculation. The crazy financiarisation of our world made many collectible objects prices skyrocket (see old cars, art, etc). But Contemporary art is the best of all, because, contrary to ancient art or old ferraris, its supply is un…

Don't forget that fine art "directly held" is exempt from FBAR reporting.

Re: The $2M Urinal: Why Hard Work Doesn’t Cut It (2018)

#138

Post by ggggtez »

fginionio wrote: post #129
ggggtez wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One thing to consider is that being a case of the emperor's new clothes is intentional . Consider The Fountain again: The artist had the audacity to put a urinal in a gallery. It's not so much that this was a particularly lovely piece of ceramic (though some may think so). The point is the meta-awareness that urinals don't belong here . The rule-breaking is the art. The fact the emperor has no clothes is the exact re…

Nowadays, rule-breaking is no longer provocative. It's derivative. We all got the memo: there's no set definition of art, it doesn't need to be skillfully made, it doesn't need to be beautiful, it can be offensive, blah blah blah. It's not clever any more. I respect Duchamp. He made his point so eloquently that none of the imitators are adding anything to the conversation.

See Banksy's "Love is in the Bin". People are still excited when artists break convention, even if it gets harder and harder to do something unexpected.

Re: The $2M Urinal: Why Hard Work Doesn’t Cut It (2018)

#139

Post by oarabbus_ »

krapp wrote: post #112
Izkata wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Why are you assuming that modern art is arbitrary, random and has no rules? More like inference than assumption, based on occurrences like Pierre Brassau's art. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pierre_Brassau

That seems more like a criticism of art critics and the subjectivity of art valuation than modern art as a category, given that most modern art isn't done by chimpanzees. Although, ironically, the hoax itself makes it a valid form of performance art anyway.

>Although, ironically, the hoax itself makes it a valid form of performance art anyway.

This is the bullshit that makes people weary of modern art. If you disagree, you fail to realize that this post, and indeed hacker news itself, is postmodern performance/interactivity art. Your opinion is wrong and invalid if you disagree.

Re: The $2M Urinal: Why Hard Work Doesn’t Cut It (2018)

#140

Post by pradn »

JansjoFromIkea wrote: post #95
paganel wrote: post #67

Whenever people discuss about contemporary art I get reminded of these incredibly poignant Soviet war paintings [1] which manage to partially describe what the atrocities on the Eastern Front meant for the people involved, but which are nevertheless a lot less well-known compared to contemporary art "darlings" like Jackson Pollock whose works don't tell me absolutely anything and who had his career propped up by the…

Not even a Pollock fan but the idea that a scan of a Pollock painting is at all similar to standing in front of one seems like a huge stretch. They absolutely huge and the paint is layered on very thick in a way that almost forces you to deconstruct the process of its production as you look at it. This other painting on the other hand, I'd be very surprised if there's more to be gotten from seeing it in person that w…

I was wary of Pollock's works, but yes: they really are fantastic experiences in person.
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