Weekend ‘catch-up sleep’ is a lie • Hacker News Board

Re: Weekend ‘catch-up sleep’ is a lie

#171

Post by cr1895 » Wed, Mar 06, 2019, 2:48 PM UTC

unabst wrote: post #140

Frondo wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is always the implicit question, and I'm guessing the answer is scientism -- material that has the form of academic product, but isn't academic. Like Jordon Peterson videos or a lot of the scientific racism stuff on Youtube. It's draped in the language of knowing, but it's purely emotional material; stuff that makes you feel good, and makes you feel smart for feeling right. (I also think the desire to drape our…

Jordan Peterson is as scientific as a social scientist gets. He cites papers and describes the work of past scientists and his premises are evidence driven. He is a professor; a professional academic. He has his opinions, positions and motives just like anyone else, but is open about them. If anything he is a rock star lecturer that exemplifies how informative, accurate, sincere, progressive, intimate, and inspiring…

The effusive praise bordering on reverence of Peterson always strikes me a bit strange. He is an exemplary rock star lecturer-scientist and if you aren't on Team Peterson you've got issues or you misunderstand or if you disagree with him you probably are pretty much a science denialist. A bit excessive, no?

Re: Weekend ‘catch-up sleep’ is a lie

#172

Post by roland35 » Wed, Mar 06, 2019, 2:53 PM UTC

CalRobert wrote: post #118

When I first had a kid, it was living hell. I mean, it was wonderful, and joyful (really, I'm not kidding) but waking up 5 times a night with a screaming 2 month old was effing brutal. I wore a 50 yard stare all the time, my colleagues tell me. Now, though, with an 18 month old I do a lot better - maybe even better than before having her. She still wakes up early (6:30 AM or so) BUT now that I know I absolutely, posi…

That is so true how it changes when you KNOW you will be up at a certain hour... I can't ignore my son as easily as I could ignore my dog if it is up too early!

I have the opposite problem though my son is already a night owl and keeps finding excuses to come back to our room and tell us random things!

Re: Weekend ‘catch-up sleep’ is a lie

#173

Post by dageshi » Wed, Mar 06, 2019, 2:53 PM UTC

mruts wrote: post #105

lm28469 wrote: post #85

Sleep is fun, people who regularly lack it will tell you they're "just fine" but they've been lacking sleep for so long that the baseline they're comparing themselves to is already skewed. Take two weeks off, avoid alcohol and other stimulant, avoid artificial light after 8 and wake up without an alarm. You'll see how you feel after that regimen. Your body knows exactly how much sleep it needs. But that's not compati…

I dunno, maybe I’m weird, but without an alarm I can sleep 12 hours. And when I do, I feel like total shit: very tired, groggy, and a little depressed. If I sleep 5-7 hours on the otherhand, I feel much better.

I would guess at least some of that would be catchup sleep + dehydration from not drinking in 12 hours.

Re: Weekend ‘catch-up sleep’ is a lie

#174

Post by Frondo » Wed, Mar 06, 2019, 2:54 PM UTC

unabst wrote: post #140

Frondo wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is always the implicit question, and I'm guessing the answer is scientism -- material that has the form of academic product, but isn't academic. Like Jordon Peterson videos or a lot of the scientific racism stuff on Youtube. It's draped in the language of knowing, but it's purely emotional material; stuff that makes you feel good, and makes you feel smart for feeling right. (I also think the desire to drape our…

Jordan Peterson is as scientific as a social scientist gets. He cites papers and describes the work of past scientists and his premises are evidence driven. He is a professor; a professional academic. He has his opinions, positions and motives just like anyone else, but is open about them. If anything he is a rock star lecturer that exemplifies how informative, accurate, sincere, progressive, intimate, and inspiring…

If he is such a stellar scientist, I'm sure there are quite a few other scientists building off his work -- I'm sure he's advancing some fields of study, if he is as sharp as you say.

Is there a list of people building on the work of Jordan Peterson? I'd like to see it.

Re: Weekend ‘catch-up sleep’ is a lie

#175

Post by x122212 » Wed, Mar 06, 2019, 2:59 PM UTC

Frondo wrote: post #127

Ragnarork wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Academia has had their chance Oh, so what should we go to now in order to try to expand our knowledge about this? What are you suggesting?

This is always the implicit question, and I'm guessing the answer is scientism -- material that has the form of academic product, but isn't academic. Like Jordon Peterson videos or a lot of the scientific racism stuff on Youtube. It's draped in the language of knowing, but it's purely emotional material; stuff that makes you feel good, and makes you feel smart for feeling right. (I also think the desire to drape our…

The irony is thick here. All of this can be said about social sciences and gender studies.

Re: Weekend ‘catch-up sleep’ is a lie

#176

Post by GIFtheory » Wed, Mar 06, 2019, 3:05 PM UTC

mruts wrote: post #105

lm28469 wrote: post #85

Sleep is fun, people who regularly lack it will tell you they're "just fine" but they've been lacking sleep for so long that the baseline they're comparing themselves to is already skewed. Take two weeks off, avoid alcohol and other stimulant, avoid artificial light after 8 and wake up without an alarm. You'll see how you feel after that regimen. Your body knows exactly how much sleep it needs. But that's not compati…

I dunno, maybe I’m weird, but without an alarm I can sleep 12 hours. And when I do, I feel like total shit: very tired, groggy, and a little depressed. If I sleep 5-7 hours on the otherhand, I feel much better.

Could it be CO2 build-up in your bedroom?

Re: Weekend ‘catch-up sleep’ is a lie

#177

Post by unabst » Wed, Mar 06, 2019, 3:06 PM UTC

cr1895 wrote: post #171

unabst wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Jordan Peterson is as scientific as a social scientist gets. He cites papers and describes the work of past scientists and his premises are evidence driven. He is a professor; a professional academic. He has his opinions, positions and motives just like anyone else, but is open about them. If anything he is a rock star lecturer that exemplifies how informative, accurate, sincere, progressive, intimate, and inspiring…

The effusive praise bordering on reverence of Peterson always strikes me a bit strange. He is an exemplary rock star lecturer-scientist and if you aren't on Team Peterson you've got issues or you misunderstand or if you disagree with him you probably are pretty much a science denialist. A bit excessive, no?

Excessive maybe, but not false, and only to counter his blatant miscategorization to which I was responding. I underestimated the support for JDP here, which is my bad but I am happy to defend him. My mother is an anthropologist. The social sciences are flawed in many ways but JDP fully acknowledges and navigates this. If anyone has better ideas or conclusions than he does please share. He wants to know. We all want to know. But if there is one thing a man answering his calling deserves is respect.

Re: Weekend ‘catch-up sleep’ is a lie

#178

Post by onemoresoop » Wed, Mar 06, 2019, 3:07 PM UTC

mruts wrote: post #105

lm28469 wrote: post #85

Sleep is fun, people who regularly lack it will tell you they're "just fine" but they've been lacking sleep for so long that the baseline they're comparing themselves to is already skewed. Take two weeks off, avoid alcohol and other stimulant, avoid artificial light after 8 and wake up without an alarm. You'll see how you feel after that regimen. Your body knows exactly how much sleep it needs. But that's not compati…

I dunno, maybe I’m weird, but without an alarm I can sleep 12 hours. And when I do, I feel like total shit: very tired, groggy, and a little depressed. If I sleep 5-7 hours on the otherhand, I feel much better.

I have the same problem. The more I sleep past 7 hours the shittier I feel for roughly the number of overslept hours. If I sleep 12 hours, I'll feel foggy and groggy for 5 hours afterwards (12-7=5). I think it is serotonin related.

I force myself to not sleep more than 7 hours.

Re: Weekend ‘catch-up sleep’ is a lie

#179

Post by onemoresoop » Wed, Mar 06, 2019, 3:09 PM UTC

GIFtheory wrote: post #176

mruts wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I dunno, maybe I’m weird, but without an alarm I can sleep 12 hours. And when I do, I feel like total shit: very tired, groggy, and a little depressed. If I sleep 5-7 hours on the otherhand, I feel much better.

Could it be CO2 build-up in your bedroom?

No. Same thing happens if the window is left ajar.

Re: Weekend ‘catch-up sleep’ is a lie

#180

Post by gboudrias » Wed, Mar 06, 2019, 3:11 PM UTC

unabst wrote: post #163

gboudrias wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If he offends you then you either have issues or don't understand him or both, but he would gladly engage with you either way. Hmmm no we can also think he uses mostly weak papers with dodgy methodologies and over-generalizes the conclusions. Not all scientists within a field agree with any given scientist of that field, that would be ludicrous.

How do you know he uses mostly weak papers? That is an overgeneralization. And why would he? Which papers should he have chosen? And I never said all scientists agree. Typical straw man. But what I will say is there are plenty of climate change deniers that claim to be scientists.

You literally said if he offends me I have issues or don't understand him. This disregards the notion that you can understand someone as a fellow scientist and be offended by their indefensible interpretations. Sorry but it's not all black or white, and you describing the issue as such makes you more of a zealot than a scientist.