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European Parliament set to end EU-wide daylight savings

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Re: European Parliament set to end EU-wide daylight savings

#131

Post by Reason077 »

paulsutter wrote: post #10
henrikschroder wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How much daylight you lose depend highly on what latitude you are living. In California, daylight savings actually makes sense, it's a noticeable boost of daylight for your office commute in the winter. In northern Europe, it makes absolutely no sense, because the darkness consumes everything anyway. It takes about a week or two for sunrise to be at the same time it was before the clock adjustment each fall. It's pre…

If “daylight savings” time is so great, why not keep it all year round? Why change at all?

> "If “daylight savings” time is so great, why not keep it all year round?"

This is exactly what many countries are proposing. Rather than abolish summer time, just make it permanent.

Re: European Parliament set to end EU-wide daylight savings

#132

Post by oblio »

int_19h wrote: post #49
widforss wrote: post #44

Is the full colorization of Cyprus a result of a political statement or just ignorance?

EU does not officially recognize Northern Cyprus.

Nobody recognizes Northern Cyprus.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northern_Cyprus:

> No nation other than Turkey has officially recognised Northern Cyprus as a sovereign state. The United Nations recognises it as territory of the Republic of Cyprus under Turkish occupation.

Re: European Parliament set to end EU-wide daylight savings

#133

Post by gsa »

diminish wrote: post #107

The `daylight saving` purpose is intriguing. I'm very curious why people long time ago, decided to change clocks, instead of work/school start and finish times. Like we start in April at 8:00 am, and in November, at 9:00.

Growing up in India (which has no DST), that's how it worked. School would start later during the winter months.

Re: European Parliament set to end EU-wide daylight savings

#134

Post by topbanana »

sambucini wrote: post #40

I work in energy trading in Europe and for us this is a blessing. Of course we store our time series TZ aware, but many less professional small utilities or other market participants (incl. Grid operators) who e.g. Order power on hourly resolution with tz-unaware excel spreadsheets via email are a nightmare as each participants treatment of double or missing hours is different and requires manual processing.

I did some work in this sector about 10 years ago. We wrote a system to parse these spreadsheets, and convert the various units of measure. At the time, we were processing the data faster than anyone else and used that data to our advantage.

The reason we couldn't mandate our own system was that many facilities are jointly owned, and we only had the primary ownership of a minority of facilities.

Not surprised this hasn't changed !

Re: European Parliament set to end EU-wide daylight savings

#135

Post by logifail »

Spearchucker wrote: post #23
lsh wrote: post #2

> mandated EU-wide summer time has only existed since 2002 and this repeal only repeals the mandatory adherence to daylight savings. Their next problem is consistency and coordination of the removal of DST among member states. And the Germans seem to be dominating the vote as well, so the really hard work in negotiating with others to remove their DST is the real barrier.

" And the Germans seem to be dominating the vote... " On what basis are Germany dominating the vote? They cannot. No EU member state can dominate a vote. Germany could at best lobby other member states, as other member states can (and do) lobby Germany.

> On what basis are Germany dominating the vote?

"In the largest survey ever conducted by the European Commission, 80% of around 4.6 million respondents said they favor abolishing the finicky practice of changing the clocks in summer and winter"

"While citizens from all EU member states voted in the poll, around two-thirds of responses came from Germany "

https://qz.com/1375622/eu-citizens-voted-to-abolish-daylight...

Re: European Parliament set to end EU-wide daylight savings

#136

Post by ddebernardy »

tobyhinloopen wrote: post #83
tirpen wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no natural law stipulating when rush hour happens or when buissness hours should be though. Shops will just start to open at 10 instead of 9 and workdays will start at 9 instead of 8 in those areas where this is a problem.

You're forgetting some "laws". Let me list them in order of priority: 1. Business hours must be kept in sync with the important countries next to them. This is important for communications between companies. When business hours are off by 1 hour, there is 1 hour less to communicate with your neighbour countries at business hours. That is 12.5% of the business day you cannot reliably contact another company in another…

Just spitballing, but I take it you don't participate in many multi-TZ meetings.

1. That's a non problem. If you're in meetings 8h/day the last of your worries would be TZ. Plus, such a time zone difference already exists today between e.g. France and the UK, Portugal and Spain, or for that matter within the US and other countries, and even within US states themselves (see AZ).

2. No it doesn't. What's most problematic when setting appointments actually is when daylight savings changes times. During the switch your regularly scheduled meetings may get messed up, times that worked for an entire remote team might no longer work for a week or two, and mishaps on new meeting schedules are all over the place. See e.g. https://youtu.be/84aWtseb2-4?t=230 to get a sense of how nutty it can get.

3. 4. I'm failing to see how using daylight savings or not makes any difference.

Re: European Parliament set to end EU-wide daylight savings

#137

Post by SyneRyder »

Spearchucker wrote: post #23
lsh wrote: post #2

> mandated EU-wide summer time has only existed since 2002 and this repeal only repeals the mandatory adherence to daylight savings. Their next problem is consistency and coordination of the removal of DST among member states. And the Germans seem to be dominating the vote as well, so the really hard work in negotiating with others to remove their DST is the real barrier.

" And the Germans seem to be dominating the vote... " On what basis are Germany dominating the vote? They cannot. No EU member state can dominate a vote. Germany could at best lobby other member states, as other member states can (and do) lobby Germany.

> On what basis are Germany dominating the vote?

The initial EU online public vote was dominated by German voters. There were 4.6 Million votes, of which 3 Million came from Germany [1]:

"More than 80 percent of respondents to the largest online survey in EU history are in favor of abolishing changing the clocks in summer and winter, EU sources reported Wednesday. Around 4.6 million people took part in the survey, which ran between July 4 and August 16. Three million of the respondents were from Germany.

And from the EU Commission report [2]:

"It should be noted that the largest amount of responses came from Germany (70% of all replies), which has a statistical influence on the average results."

That said, from section 3.2 of the EU Commission report, Cyprus & Greece were the only two countries where citizens voted to keep daylight saving.

[1] https://www.dw.com/en/eu-citizens-feel-times-up-for-changing...

[2] https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?uri=CELEX:52...

Re: European Parliament set to end EU-wide daylight savings

#138

Post by C1sc0cat »

LoSboccacc wrote: post #37
jaabe wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We changed our educational grading scale a few years back to make it comparable to the international scale. One of the huge problems was that we had a top-grade for people who went “beyond” expectations for the course. Because “beyond” is up for interpretation, some examiners were more likely to give it than others, but in general it was just extremely hard to earn a top mark and no one really knew what was needed to…

?? Most international scales include laude

That's News to Me in the UK

Re: European Parliament set to end EU-wide daylight savings

#139

Post by C1sc0cat »

bad_user wrote: post #58
_Microft wrote: post #54

All of that because of a stupid survey in which the ones who wanted to abolish daylight saving time were overrepresented because it gave them a platform while the majority who doesn't, didn't bother to make themselves heard. That's not quite Brexit-level but maybe Swiss immigration referendum -stupidity.

Why do you think abolishing the daylight savings change is bad? Personally I think it’s a super awesome move. And note that no matter what you have against it, disrupting the sleep of billions of people twice per year has caused depression and cardiovascular issues which shouldn’t be taken lightly. So what’s the issue in everyone switching to the summer time for the whole year?

It also helps reduce power usage and farmers also like the extra daylight for doing you know farmer things.

Re: European Parliament set to end EU-wide daylight savings

#140

Post by rudde »

henrikschroder wrote: post #7
paganel wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s mindboggling depressing to lose an hour of daylight each day for almost half a year because you’re stuck in an office at work.

How much daylight you lose depend highly on what latitude you are living. In California, daylight savings actually makes sense, it's a noticeable boost of daylight for your office commute in the winter. In northern Europe, it makes absolutely no sense, because the darkness consumes everything anyway. It takes about a week or two for sunrise to be at the same time it was before the clock adjustment each fall. It's pre…

We have these other seasons in northern Europe, called autumn and spring.
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