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Let’s Destroy Robocalls

nytimes.com

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Re: Let’s Destroy Robocalls

#181

Post by angel_j »

SlowRobotAhead wrote: post #166
angel_j wrote: post #138

We should destroy phone numbers instead, not only for spam, but for privacy and security. You might as well wear an RFID on your collar. Replace phone numbers with DNS and spam blocking. Change it when you want instead of asking your provider. Tell people to contact you through your website.

Sounds good. Would you mind getting in touch with my mom to explain that system to her? THANKS!

> Would you mind getting in touch with my mom to explain that system to her?

I am your mom, robothead!

this is your mother, honey!!

don't @ me in these ignorant shit-posts of yours, please.

love, mommy

Re: Let’s Destroy Robocalls

#182

Post by Leace »

atombender wrote: post #158
cletus wrote: post #62

So robocalls are the result of: - Cost of phone calls decreasing to basically zero - Cost of automation going to basically zero - Phone calls that can come from the Internet so there are no national boundaries anymore - Caller ID operating on essentially the honor system - Bad actors (telephone companies) benefitting from this traffic by charging for it - Larger players having no incentive to punish bad actors There'…

Whitelisting is problematic because there are so many cases where it's impractical or impossible to add a contact first: Doctor's office calling to confirm your appointment; restaurant confirming a seat reservation; delivery guy is outside and can't find your doorbell; Lyft/Uber/whatever is nearby and is looking for you; pharmacy calling to inform about a prescription being ready; some store calling to inform that yo…

> Doctor's office calling to confirm your appointment; restaurant confirming a seat reservation; delivery guy is outside and can't find your doorbell; Lyft/Uber/whatever is nearby and is looking for you; pharmacy calling to inform about a prescription being ready; some store calling to inform that your order is ready to be picked up; insurance company calling about some claim; etc.

The problem is phone number that is short and easy to guess. Imagine replacing them with a longer token that would be generated each time you want to give someone else a way to contact you (e.g. displaying a QR barcode on your phone and letting the other party scan it). Then you'd share a unique identifier with all that parties. Delivery guy can get a token that expires after a while. If someone abuses their ability of contacting someone, the token would get revoked.

I leave the details and implementation as an exercise for the reader ;)

Re: Let’s Destroy Robocalls

#183

Post by pavel_lishin »

darepublic wrote: post #174
atombender wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Whitelisting is problematic because there are so many cases where it's impractical or impossible to add a contact first: Doctor's office calling to confirm your appointment; restaurant confirming a seat reservation; delivery guy is outside and can't find your doorbell; Lyft/Uber/whatever is nearby and is looking for you; pharmacy calling to inform about a prescription being ready; some store calling to inform that yo…

Need intelligent chat agents to receive calls on your behalf and act appropriate, just as you would -- arranging legit appointments, coordinating pick up times with the spouse and trolling offshore scammers by dangling red herring personal info to keep their resources tied as long as possible.

"Once again, sir, we're terribly sorry that Alexa misunderstood your daycare provider due to their accent. Due to your loss, please accept this $20 Audible credit to your account."

Re: Let’s Destroy Robocalls

#184

Post by pavel_lishin »

cabalamat wrote: post #170
Loughla wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So shift the burden of calling to literally everyone who is acting well? Why would I want to remember a unique PIN for everyone I know? Also, isn't that just taking the 9 digit phone number and turning it into a 12 digit?

You could have a Captcha to force that the person on the calling ewnd is a person and not a computer. That would increase the costs for telemarketeers. Or the system could ask for information that someone who knows the recipient might know but a telemarketeer might not know, e.g. "What is the 2nd letter of my first name?"

That still shifts the burden onto everyone else.

Re: Let’s Destroy Robocalls

#185

Post by [deleted] »

cletus wrote: post #62

So robocalls are the result of: - Cost of phone calls decreasing to basically zero - Cost of automation going to basically zero - Phone calls that can come from the Internet so there are no national boundaries anymore - Caller ID operating on essentially the honor system - Bad actors (telephone companies) benefitting from this traffic by charging for it - Larger players having no incentive to punish bad actors There'…

[deleted]

Re: Let’s Destroy Robocalls

#186

Post by reaperducer »

tprynn wrote: post #90
autotune wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

iPhone at least has the option for a contacts only whitelist, I only get notifications from contacts and everything else gets ignored. No point in even considering answering a call from someone I don’t know, if it’s truly important they can leave a message and I respond asap.

That's only true with Do Not Disturb, which also silences all other notifications as well, a major drawback (for me, at least).

If your other contacts have "VIP" status in the contact list, they will automatically go through.

I'm not sure if it works for non-Apple apps, though.

Re: Let’s Destroy Robocalls

#187

Post by reaperducer »

TheSpiceIsLife wrote: post #93
cletus wrote: post #62

So robocalls are the result of: - Cost of phone calls decreasing to basically zero - Cost of automation going to basically zero - Phone calls that can come from the Internet so there are no national boundaries anymore - Caller ID operating on essentially the honor system - Bad actors (telephone companies) benefitting from this traffic by charging for it - Larger players having no incentive to punish bad actors There'…

The only reason that matters here is bad actors . What kind of lack of compassion do you have to have to participate in an organisation that generates something universally hated.

There's some kind of mental disconnect involved.

I once knew a guy who ran a spam operation from Chicago. I was in his office once and he showed me something on his computer. In doing so I could see that his mail in-box had over 29,000 unread messages.

I asked him how he deals with all those spam messages. He didn't think it was a big deal at all. Spam simply didn't bother him, and he believed in his heart that spam doesn't really bother anyone else, either.

Re: Let’s Destroy Robocalls

#188

Post by reaperducer »

jerf wrote: post #120
sacul wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

(This turned into a bit of a rant...) So, AFAICT, Hustle provides a service that's nearly as bad as robocalls. From their front page: "Hustle works because people read and respond to texts—and to communication that feels more human." So it's a bait and switch, just like a robocall: you contact me in a way that makes you feel personal, approachable and reasonable to me so that you can gain my attention. Look, try to s…

I am currently being hammered by robocalls, in relative terms at least. I can't remember the last time I got an unsolicited text. An anecdote to be sure, but I don't hear anyone complaining right now about unsolicited texts, so it doesn't seem like Hustle is the problem. "I still want to have access whenever I want it. Maybe I can't have it both ways?" You can, actually, and it isn't that hard. I have a strict "one s…

I don't hear anyone complaining right now about unsolicited texts

Really? You must not be listening. Do a quick Google News search and you'll find dozens of articles about it.

My T-Mobile hotspot has 133 unsolicited (and unread) text messages in it right now because spammers think it's a cell phone.

During the last election I received 50 or 60 unsolicited political text messages from both parties on my work phone.

Unsolicited text is a problem.

Re: Let’s Destroy Robocalls

#189

Post by reaperducer »

cfallin wrote: post #84

One solution, not practical for most folks but works well for me: live in a different area code than phone number. (My cell number is in the area code I grew up in.) It seems most spam calls either fake a source number that's in my phone's area code, or use a completely random source. Almost any inbound call I actually expect without an address-book entry would come from my (new) local area code, so I can pick up a c…

I don't hear anyone complaining right now about unsolicited texts

Something that works for me is to have a phone number in a low-value area code. My Seattle and New York numbers get robocalls. My phone numbers in certain other parts of the country are left alone.

Re: Let’s Destroy Robocalls

#190

Post by reaperducer »

bonobo_34 wrote: post #128
cfallin wrote: post #84

One solution, not practical for most folks but works well for me: live in a different area code than phone number. (My cell number is in the area code I grew up in.) It seems most spam calls either fake a source number that's in my phone's area code, or use a completely random source. Almost any inbound call I actually expect without an address-book entry would come from my (new) local area code, so I can pick up a c…

I get a lot of robocalls from spoofed numbers that have my area code and even the first 3 digits of my phone number in common. I guess the thought is that people are more likely to pick up if the number looks familiar? For me, it's just an indication of a robo call that I won't pick up.

It's called "neighborhood" spamming. You're supposed to think it's a neighbor calling.
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