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Taxing Uber and Lyft rides is L.A's latest plan to free up congested roads

latimes.com

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Re: Taxing Uber and Lyft rides is L.A's latest plan to free up congested roads

#271

Post by C1sc0cat »

ozzyman700 wrote: post #265
nickles wrote: post #3

> Uber and Lyft “are using public roads, and the profit is going to their companies,” Phil Washington, Metro’s chief executive, said at a recent meeting. Public roads are supposed to be paid for through fuel taxes, which every Uber and Lyft driver pays. California has gasoline taxes of: * 55.22c per gallon (second only to Pennsylvania) * 18.4c per gallon (federal) * 2.25% sales tax Additionally, taxing only rideshari…

In my opinion, all taxes besides a land value tax are poor solutions. rent is the final resting place of capital generated by labor and land combined. Taxing unused land higher than used land forces landowners to sell the land to someone who could use the land productively enough to afford the tax bill. All of taxes deter productivity from increasing. It is better to tax the land date trees grow on, than to tax the o…

Lots of ways around that just demolish any buildings stick some goats on to graze and call it a farm "get oorf moi land revenue - waves shotgun"

Re: Taxing Uber and Lyft rides is L.A's latest plan to free up congested roads

#273

Post by JustSomeNobody »

Dylan16807 wrote: post #244
foepys wrote: post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You could tax trucks like 1000 times more. But don't expect the butter and milk to stay the same price.

The milk would cost more, but we'd save even more money on road maintenance. Then many trucks could be adjusted to have more axles and lighter loads, saving money on both ends. The end result is a better system.

> The milk would cost more, but we'd save even more money on road maintenance.

This would adversely affect the poor as they drive less and still need milk.

Re: Taxing Uber and Lyft rides is L.A's latest plan to free up congested roads

#274

Post by JustSomeNobody »

mc32 wrote: post #57
SilasX wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's misleading -- yes, in the aggregate, gas taxes cover only part of the expenses, but that's not because of personal cars . Damage on the roads -- and thus maintenance costs -- scales with the 4th power of weight per axle. So the damage is virtually all from large trucks, with sedans and SUVs as a rounding error. If you were to apportion out the maintenance cost due to personal cars, they are overpaying.

Exactly this. Of course, if they tax per axle and tonnage combination, it’ll just be passed on to consumers anyhow as most of trucks are distributing goods which directly or indirectly end up in the hands of consumers. However, it would be quite fair to do, I think.

It's not that simple. HN readers could absorb the increase, but the poor can't.

Re: Taxing Uber and Lyft rides is L.A's latest plan to free up congested roads

#275

Post by Balero »

briandear wrote: post #66
shereadsthenews wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fuel tax revenue and other direct user fees like annual registration in California amount to less than 25% of what the state and its cities pay to maintain the roads and streets. Roads are massively subsidized from general revenues. If you are proposing a $5/gallon fuel tax then I completely agree. That would be about equivalent to what other rich countries tax motor fuel and consistent with the state's greenhouse ga…

Those roads are what allow stuff to be delivered. How do you ship an air conditioning unit on a bike path? The point is that the roads serve commerce and a tax on roads is really a tax on everything. Roads aren’t exactly massively subsidized — the commerce they generate results in taxes. Tax revenue generated per mile driven is far greater than any supposed subsidy. We could make an argument that schools are massivel…

"You are also incorrect suggesting that $5 per gallon is “about equivalent to what other rich countries tax motor fuel.” In France, it’s $2.77 per gallon. In the UK, it’s $2.83 per gallon. Netherlands is $3.5 per gallon. Sweden is $3.51. In Australia, it’s $1.12 per gallon, New Zealand is $1.58. None of those countries are even close to $5 per gallon."

This is incorrect, in the UK at least. The best price I get is about £1.21 per liter. Which is $1.61 per liter Or $7.31 per Gallon.

So we are well over $5 a gallon. Don't forget the USA is pretty much the only country to measure liquid volume in gallons, we all use liters - 1L = 4.54609 Gallons

Re: Taxing Uber and Lyft rides is L.A's latest plan to free up congested roads

#276

Post by sokoloff »

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #78
briandear wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why should less efficient vehicles be taxed more? If they are already paying more for fuel, doesn’t that already “tax” them more? It seems like such a tax is regressive — rich people can buy new efficient cars more easily than poor people.

> Why should less efficient vehicles be taxed more? Taxation serves two purposes: (a) to fund roads, and (b) to discourage society damaging behavior. For (a), we need to tax all vehicles, for (b), we need to tax some vehicles more than others. > It seems like such a tax is regressive — rich people can buy new efficient cars more easily than poor people. True. Perhaps the efficiency tax can be built into the initial n…

We’ve had a federal “gas guzzler tax” (or new car sales) since 1978. (USA)

Re: Taxing Uber and Lyft rides is L.A's latest plan to free up congested roads

#277

Post by sokoloff »

thisisweirdok wrote: post #155
updateYourMind wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a very bad solution, especially as share rides decrease the number of cars when people use uber pool

Talk to anyone with a reasonable public transit system about how ridesharing is clearing up the roads (spoiler alert: it's not, they're decreasing public transit ridership and contributing to a constantly worsening congestion issue).

Perhaps public transit systems could look into what ride-sharing is doing, what elements of it are so appealing to users, and if there’s any similar actions they could offer to make public transit more appealing.

Re: Taxing Uber and Lyft rides is L.A's latest plan to free up congested roads

#278

Post by SilasX »

foepys wrote: post #213
mikeash wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, the average car in the US gets about 25MPG, while the average tractor trailer is 6MPG, so about 4x the fuel per mile. Accounting for the higher tax rate, they’re paying maybe 5x the tax per mile, while causing maybe 5,000x the damage.

You could tax trucks like 1000 times more. But don't expect the butter and milk to stay the same price.

We’re paying for it either way. I’d rather the payment be apportioned by the extent to which you use products that have to be transported that way; it gets the incentives right.

Re: Taxing Uber and Lyft rides is L.A's latest plan to free up congested roads

#279

Post by Amendeson530 »

Yet again the "achilles heal" of mass transit it exposed. Uber and Lyft work because they go where I want to go and when I want to go at a reasonable price.

Busses are not full of people who want to ride the bus, they are full of people who must ride the bus.

No amount of taxation will ever change that.

Re: Taxing Uber and Lyft rides is L.A's latest plan to free up congested roads

#280

Post by xkcd-sucks »

nickles wrote: post #3

> Uber and Lyft “are using public roads, and the profit is going to their companies,” Phil Washington, Metro’s chief executive, said at a recent meeting. Public roads are supposed to be paid for through fuel taxes, which every Uber and Lyft driver pays. California has gasoline taxes of: * 55.22c per gallon (second only to Pennsylvania) * 18.4c per gallon (federal) * 2.25% sales tax Additionally, taxing only rideshari…

Is "drunk driving" the new "the children"?
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