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Paul Graham on the Transition to Meat Substitutes

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Re: Paul Graham on the Transition to Meat Substitutes

#21

Post by eigenstuff »

Majromax wrote: post #17
hprotagonist wrote: post #2

One thing i’d genuinely like to see more of in the US is easy and sanely priced access to wild game. Deer populations being what they are, and populations of environmentally troublesome species such as feral boars being what they are, it seems like a net win. i would love to be able to get my hands on venison or boar that’s been processed in a USDA-approved way, because the meat’s high quality, the animals had lives…

> One thing i’d genuinely like to see more of in the US is easy and sanely priced access to wild game. That could pose a problem with Chronic Wasting Disease ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chronic_wasting_disease ). Prion illnesses are no joke, so widespread consumption of wild game in North America presents a small but concerning risk of spreading the disease to humans.

Chronic wasting disease wouldn't affect wild hogs, though, and wild hogs are destroying the environment in Texas.

Re: Paul Graham on the Transition to Meat Substitutes

#22

Post by dec0dedab0de »

hprotagonist wrote: post #2

One thing i’d genuinely like to see more of in the US is easy and sanely priced access to wild game. Deer populations being what they are, and populations of environmentally troublesome species such as feral boars being what they are, it seems like a net win. i would love to be able to get my hands on venison or boar that’s been processed in a USDA-approved way, because the meat’s high quality, the animals had lives…

The problem is that if it becomes profitable then the "wild" game will slowly transition into farming.

Re: Paul Graham on the Transition to Meat Substitutes

#23

Post by hprotagonist »

dec0dedab0de wrote: post #22
hprotagonist wrote: post #2

One thing i’d genuinely like to see more of in the US is easy and sanely priced access to wild game. Deer populations being what they are, and populations of environmentally troublesome species such as feral boars being what they are, it seems like a net win. i would love to be able to get my hands on venison or boar that’s been processed in a USDA-approved way, because the meat’s high quality, the animals had lives…

The problem is that if it becomes profitable then the "wild" game will slowly transition into farming.

it’s already happened, but supply is low and prices are correspondingly exorbitant.

Re: Paul Graham on the Transition to Meat Substitutes

#24

Post by iambateman »

Living in SC, we live on the edge of the urban-rural divide. I anticipate the urban transition to meatless happening pretty quickly but I could see substantial opposition from rural people for a couple reasons:

(1) they’re closer to the people actually farming cattle. (2) a general distrust of science (3) the price drop to the traditional meat market as tremendous new supply floods the market.

Re: Paul Graham on the Transition to Meat Substitutes

#26

Post by siedes »

I find that these meat substitutes, vegetarian, and vegan options do not do very well because often times they are not only inferior in taste, but they cost way more. I do not see many people changing their mindsets until they can make these things significantly cheaper than eating meat products. As it is currently, vegetarianism and veganism are pretty much only available to middle class and higher people who can afford to make those choices. Healthy and environmentally-friendly options should not be a premium! They should be the default, mainstream, and accessible.

Note: Yeah, it can be cheap to go meatless if you do all the cooking yourself, but with premade products or meals at a restaurant, the vegetarian/vegan options are often priced higher, convincing no one to try them instead of affordable, flavorful meat-based dishes they are familiar with.

Re: Paul Graham on the Transition to Meat Substitutes

#27

Post by JasonFruit »

Maybe it's my rural background and associations, but I see a powerful psychological effect to eating meat from a real animal, and that won't disappear because some meat substitute tastes pretty good. I like falafel, I like shiitake mushrooms, I like a good veggie burger, but there's no substitute for the flesh of an animal — especially one I raised, where I know its diet, its experiences, and how it was slaughtered and butchered. I feel like I'd lose something essentially human in giving that up.

Re: Paul Graham on the Transition to Meat Substitutes

#28

Post by tgb »

mattmanser wrote: post #19
tgb wrote: post #8

I think he's wrong about people not having loyalty to meat. There is a ton of literal hatred for veganism and vegetarians in this world. Think of the practically cult-like following bacon has. I recall a thread some years ago on Reddit's r/fitness with someone asking for vegan protein sources due to certain allergies or other health restrictions and it was spammed with dozens of comments along the lines of "bacon" an…

I think you're very wrong and pg is spot on. I remember when Vegan/Vegetarians were sneered at in the UK 25 years ago, but they aren't now. In the space of 25 years it's gone from being rare to see veggie options, to it being the norm to have at least 25% non-meat options on the menu. Attitudes change, and once it's gone, most people will eventually find the idea of rearing animals to kill repellant. If you can deliv…

I agree with "eventually" I just think it's further along than PG and you think.

Re: Paul Graham on the Transition to Meat Substitutes

#29

Post by benj111 »

tgb wrote: post #8

I think he's wrong about people not having loyalty to meat. There is a ton of literal hatred for veganism and vegetarians in this world. Think of the practically cult-like following bacon has. I recall a thread some years ago on Reddit's r/fitness with someone asking for vegan protein sources due to certain allergies or other health restrictions and it was spammed with dozens of comments along the lines of "bacon" an…

There's 'meat' that we eat, and 'meat' as in dead animal. We've got quite good in the west at separating the 2.

I don't think steak and other cuts of meat are going anywhere that quickly. But mince, 'chicken' breast, nuggets, sausages, that kind of stuff, I can see switching fairly quickly if there was a decent, cost effective alternative.

Re: Paul Graham on the Transition to Meat Substitutes

#30

Post by paulcole »

eigenstuff wrote: post #21
Majromax wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> One thing i’d genuinely like to see more of in the US is easy and sanely priced access to wild game. That could pose a problem with Chronic Wasting Disease ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chronic_wasting_disease ). Prion illnesses are no joke, so widespread consumption of wild game in North America presents a small but concerning risk of spreading the disease to humans.

Chronic wasting disease wouldn't affect wild hogs, though, and wild hogs are destroying the environment in Texas.

The people in Texas are doing far more damage to the environment than any number of hogs could.
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