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Firefox to Block All 3rd Party Trackers by Default

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Re: Firefox to Block All 3rd Party Trackers by Default

#41
post #32
post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What if the website told the browser to load malware? Browsers in the modern web need to defend the user, not execute arbitrary instructions from random websites that nobody cares about.

A website cannot tell a browser to "load malware", unless we're talking about a exploit, which should be patched. (Please don't say "if I send you a malformed png file you have to execute the exploit, otherwise your argument breaks down".)

If I ask my User Agent to load a particular news article (for example), I am not intending to ask for a myriad companies to start monitoring my reading habits, social interactions, shopping, or anything else.

When I buy and read a newspaper, I don't expect the publisher to start following me everywhere and keeping a log of my life. When I read an article online, I shouldn't have to think about that either. But sites have so flagrantly abused the ability to deliver more than just the content I've deliberately requested, in order to track (and monetize) user behavior everywhere, that it's entirely appropriate for my User Agent to take steps to defend me.

I don't mind a site delivering some ads alongside the content I've asked for, just like I accept some ads in a printed magazine. But I don't expect my magazine to come with an embedded tracking device that will stick to me like a burr, even long after I've read the content and recycled the pages.

Re: Firefox to Block All 3rd Party Trackers by Default

#42
Good. They should've done this ten years ago.

However, I don't know how it'll play out in the long run. FF is already on the radar of ad-driven sites, including those that just need basic unique visitor counters verified by third parties rather than doing evil privacy invasion things. So they could decide to boycot FF alltogether. I hope this isn't going to happen, though. Anyone in the ad-driven content business here to share their opinion? Or should we go back to pixels?

Re: Firefox to Block All 3rd Party Trackers by Default

#43
post #8

I think this is a bad idea. Even though I personally block 3rd party trackers by default, breaking the web by default will cause problems. Also, ad blocking will start being a problem when enough people start doing it. I still remember the days of no websites yelling at you for blocking their ads. Things are going to get much worse.

> "I still remember the days of no websites yelling at you for blocking their ads."

I recommend updating your adblocker. I haven't seen that kind of crap in ages, because I block that stuff too.

Re: Firefox to Block All 3rd Party Trackers by Default

#44

One thing mentioned on the responses that might be really concerning is the fact that this will mean that for a lot of analytics it will look like firefox usage is close to zero. No usage data, devs caring less about firefox, users having more problems when using firefox, less users using firefox, less users having 3rd party trackers blocked, chrome monopoly growing.

But you're saying here that metrics might not faithfully keep track with reality; presumably an industry that cares will simply improve their metrics until they don't care.

In an ideal world yes, but what actually tends to happen is that the company starts to work towards improving their metric numbers at the cost of actually doing good business. I've seen this happen over and over again.

Re: Firefox to Block All 3rd Party Trackers by Default

#45
post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Third party cookies shouldn't exist in the first place.

I partly agree with you: they should be an earned privilege that I agree to turn on for some websites, not something turned on by default. because there are some genuine use cases, such as single sign-on, that they're actually useful for.

Eh, single-sign-on is easily fixed for most applications; just forward the entire window to the SSO provider, so the cookies are first-party, then forward back once they're logged in.

Re: Firefox to Block All 3rd Party Trackers by Default

#46
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Firefox/Mozilla is not as reliant on Google anymore as it once was, having diversified which search engine gets set in which area. There would also still be a reason for google to be the default search engine even in a browser that blocks third party trackers by default, namely the original reason of getting users to use your search engine. So I don't see a problem here and I doubt Google would or could force Mozilla…

Mozilla released the extension "Facebook Container", which is great, but that's only one of the FANG companies notorious for invading privacy. Where is the "Google Container" extension from Mozilla? There exists such an extension but it's by a third party, not by Mozilla. It would be nice to see it from Mozilla since I trust them more than I trust some random extension developer; I can feel confident in recommending…

Those container extensions are just the "Firefox Multi-Account Containers" extension developed by Mozilla with some default settings for Facebook and Google.

https://github.com/mozilla/multi-account-containers

Re: Firefox to Block All 3rd Party Trackers by Default

#47

One thing mentioned on the responses that might be really concerning is the fact that this will mean that for a lot of analytics it will look like firefox usage is close to zero. No usage data, devs caring less about firefox, users having more problems when using firefox, less users using firefox, less users having 3rd party trackers blocked, chrome monopoly growing.

Alternatively, it work to FF's benefit that no one can know what the real percentage of users are. There might be some positive press around "the numbers in Analytics do not reflect users on FF"

Nah. People making decisions don't care. Firefox usage will be reported as super low, and it won't be tested.

Re: Firefox to Block All 3rd Party Trackers by Default

#48
post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"breaking the web by default" It's not breaking the web, it's breaking part of the web's grasp on users. Is the web for people or is it there to use people? "Ad blocking will start being a problem" I live in the days where both all ads and all bullshit responses to my adblocker ("don't block my ads!!") are blocked; it's a breeze of fresh air. Sometimes a site tries to get around it and I block it permanently.

What do you use to block the requests to disable your ad blocker?

Between uBlock Origin and uMatrix in whitelist mode, you'll virtually never see those "disable your blocker" nags.
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